From: darth router (darklordrouter@gmail.com)
Date: Sat Mar 01 2008 - 03:28:45 ARST
Well,
I'm not agreeing that selling your number is a good thing to do. I believe
the people considering doing this are working for non cisco parnters, and
want to capitalize on that extra cash. Like ISPs for example, in a lot of
those core jobs, they don't give a crap if you have a CCIE. Scott V, I
didn't read through that info you sent yet, but I did dig very hard a few mo
ago and read through the partner requirements specifically because a Silver
partner wanted to buy my number in the event I did not work for another
partner. All they had to do was hire me part time, or just say I was working
on one of "their" full time contracts as a contractor. We looked into it. I
think it comes back to this article again. You can rent your cert, and
people are doing this right now. If you try to work for a partner and rent
your cert out to a third party, yea your screwed, because that is against
the rules.. But if your a consultant, why the heck not? So you work a few
hours a week on that partners full time contract, and you do the majority of
your work for clients who don't need it. No big deal. If the partner gets
audited and trouble arises, it's their problem, not mine. I didn't see
anywhere in the CCIE terms of use saying I could not do this. It's really
the partner doing the dirty deed, if it is in fact a dirty deed.
http://www.networkworld.com/community/node/19970?t51hb
On 2/29/08, Scott Morris <smorris@ipexpert.com> wrote:
>
> Used to be able to... But now the requirements are that you have to have
> SEPARATE people. :) even Premiere partner requires three physically
> distinct people.
>
>
>
> Scott Morris, CCIE4 (R&S/ISP-Dial/Security/Service Provider) #4713,
> JNCIE-M
> #153, JNCIS-ER, CISSP, et al.
> CCSI/JNCI-M/JNCI-ER
> VP - Technical Training - IPexpert, Inc.
> IPexpert Sr. Technical Instructor
>
> A Cisco Learning Partner - We Accept Learning Credits!
>
> smorris@ipexpert.com
>
>
>
> Telephone: +1.810.326.1444
> Fax: +1.810.454.0130
> http://www.ipexpert.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
> Joseph Brunner
>
> Sent: Friday, February 29, 2008 9:26 PM
> To: 'Colin McNamara'; 'Cisco certification'
> Subject: RE: Unassigned CCIE query.
>
> >you WILL make less when you finally go to a partner
>
> WTF?
>
> Doesn't anyone start their OWN company any more?
>
> Why can't a CCIE become a partner!
>
> As soon as my guy takes his cisco sales expert blah cert.
>
> We'll have advanced routing & advanced security status.
>
> One question?
>
> If you are a quad jedi can you yourself staff the 4 CCIE requirements of a
> gold partner?
>
> Thanks
>
> Joe
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
> Colin McNamara
> Sent: Friday, February 29, 2008 9:21 PM
> To: Cisco certification
> Subject: RE: Unassigned CCIE query.
>
> I am not a lawyer, and this is not legal advice. But if you read the
> verbiage it says that the Partner must have x number of employees full
> time.
> There is not a penalty to you, the CCIE being used in that audit
> submission.
>
> That being said, don't be retarded and sell your number. Not only does it
> play games with the entire channel structure, you WILL make less when you
> finally go to a partner, and they have to wait a year for your # to come
> free.
>
> --
> Colin McNamara
> (858)208-8105
> CCIE #18233,RHCE,GCIH
> http://www.colinmcnamara.com
> http://www.linkedin.com/in/colinmcnamara
>
> "The difficult we do immediately, the impossible just takes a little
> longer"
>
> On Fri, 2008-02-29 at 16:53 -0700, Scott Vermillion wrote:
> > Hey Darth,
> >
> >
> > If you read the rules in the link that I posted up, it says that CCIEs
> must
> > be full-time employees/contractors that are dedicated *exclusively* to
> > the partner in question. In other words, if you rent your number out
> > for $2k
> or
> > $3k/month, $24k or $36k should be your total annual income! Check the
> link.
> > I don't think there's an ambiguity whatsoever, personally. Also,
> > there's
> a
> > common sense test here. Why would Cisco allow/endorse this? Why
> > would
> they
> > establish the 4 x CCIE requirement in the first place if they were
> > going
> to
> > allow/endorse this practice whereby the CCIE do nothing at all except
> > cash
> a
> > monthly check? Are Cisco's customers benefitting from this? Is
> > Cisco's image in the marketplace being enhanced by this? Does this
> > add value to
> the
> > Gold partner status and how paying customers perceive it? Who is
> > benefitting from this and how does that tie to Cisco's bottom line?
> >
> >
> >
> > For me it's not so much a question of ethics (these are our own to
> > interpret/implement in our daily lives). It's a question of devaluing
> > the CCIE for the broader community in order to selfishly turn a few
> > bucks for yourself. That's what I personally have the problem with.
> > You want Gold status? Go hire four CCIEs at market rate. No shortcuts.
> No cheating.
> No
> > leaving four perfectly qualified CCIEs looking for work while this
> > under-the-table exchange takes place between one dishonest partner and
> four
> > dishonest and/or unenlightened CCIEs.
> >
> >
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> >
> > Scott
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: darth router [mailto:darklordrouter@gmail.com]
> > Sent: Friday, February 29, 2008 4:37 PM
> > To: Hash!!!
> > Cc: Joseph Brunner; Scott Vermillion; Darren Johnson; Cisco
> > certification
> > Subject: Re: Unassigned CCIE query.
> >
> >
> >
> > When I read into it months ago, i think it said something to the
> > extent
> that
> > you had to be "on" a full time contract. That doesn't mean you have to
> work
> > X amount of hours, but just be available. These things are not defined
> > in the rules, so technically selling your number is not breaking any
> rules.
> > People keep talking ethics, but until cisco says we can't do it, we
> > aren't breaching any ethical boundaries. Why doesn't someone just
> > submit a
> support
> > ticket and ask?
> >
> > DR
> >
> > On 2/29/08, Hash!!! <hashng@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Johnson,
> >
> > The bottom line is ...it's against the rules to sell your ID. You can
> > work as a contractor in the company but not totally sell your id.
> > Cisco
> mentioned
> > that at least 2 CCIEs must be Full time employees that leverage you to
> > do that but not Implying selling the Number.
> >
> > HTH
> >
> >
> > Hash
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf
> > Of
> >
> > Joseph Brunner
> > Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 9:08 PM
> > To: 'Scott Vermillion'; 'Darren Johnson'; 'Cisco certification'
> > Subject: RE: Unassigned CCIE query.
> >
> > This doesn't really matter, and does not prove anything.
> >
> > The GOLD PARNTER can just pay someone say $50,000 on a W2 as a CCIE
> > and
> for
> > that I agree to let them USE my number, and do at least 1 conference
> > call with their clients each month. There would be no way to tell how
> > many
> hours
> > the guy was there...
> >
> > That seems like fair use to me... How about you guys?
> >
> > Therefore, I am an employee. The deal is I'm never there, yet I still
> > get paid. They get a CCIE's number for their roster and a low salary
> > no sane CCIE would work for...
> >
> > ?
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf
> > Of Scott Vermillion
> > Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 12:51 PM
> > To: 'Darren Johnson'; 'Cisco certification'
> > Subject: RE: Unassigned CCIE query.
> >
> > Hey Darren,
> >
> > The bottom line is that you cannot do what you're proposing. Last
> > time
> this
> > came up, I (or somebody - maybe it wasn't be after all) went and found
> > the audit rules for partner status. Those made very, very clear that
> > any CCIE numbers being used for partner status had to be *full-time*
> > regular employees and that (IIRC), the auditor could review payroll
> > records, etc,
> to
> > validate that the CCIE was an active, daily participant in the business.
> >
> > I'm in the same situation. I work independently and thus my number
> floats.
> > I don't really want to work in a partner/reseller environment, though,
> > so that aspect of my number holds no value. Oh well...
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Scott
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf
> > Of Darren Johnson
> > Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 10:41 AM
> > To: 'Cisco certification'
> > Subject: Unassigned CCIE query.
> >
> > Hey all. As per my post last week, I passed the lab and now have an
> > unassigned CCIE number (I paid for study and lab myself). I'm now in a
> > position where I'm weighing up my options. Is it possible to 'rent'
> > out my CCIE number to a company, whilst still remaining employed by my
> > present employer? I have heard of rentacert.com but people seemed
> skeptical of it.
> >
> > Let me stress, I DO NOT WANT TO VIOLATE ANY CISCO POLICIES and if
> > renting out a cert is doing so, I WILL NOT DO IT. However, if it is
> > possible/legal and people out there do it, can they kindly explain how
> > it works. I want
> to
> > get as much value out of my cert as possible.
> >
> > Thanks for ANY advice
> >
> > Darren
> > #20078
> >
> >
> >
> > ___________________________________________________________
> > Try the all-new Yahoo! Mail. "The New Version is radically easier to
> use"
> > The Wall Street Journal
> > http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html
> >
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