From: Wes Stevens (wrsteve33-gsccie@yahoo.com)
Date: Thu Sep 01 2005 - 12:57:40 GMT-3
Cisco is walking a fine line. CCIE is and has been the
premier networking cert for a while now. For Cisco it
is a marketing tool. Like you say Scott, the more
cisco certified people they have in the market place,
the better. But they cannot afford to have the CCIE
cert go the way of the MCSE and loose it's value. They
have to keep the lab test difficult while being as
relevant as possible - not an easy job. The last thing
Cisco wants is to have CCIE's out there recommending
their solutions and then screwing up the design or
implementation. I know that this can happen and does
today but probably not that often compared to other
certs (microsoft comes to mind).
It is still the best gauge of networking ability there
is when you try and qualify a person by the letters
after their name. Cisco is working to keep it that
way.
--- Scott Morris <swm@emanon.com> wrote:
> Dude, if you spent half the time working on the CCIE
> lab itself, things
> would be easier. :)
>
> It's basic business marketing though to realize that
> the more people you
> have out in the workplace certified and/or
> capable/comfortable with your
> products, the more you will sell. Microsoft did
> this approach a long time
> ago. They had some difficulties, but the market
> still is there. Novell
> tried enhancing things a little too late to help
> them much.
>
> But if you have happy people out in the field,
> employed and comfortable on
> your product line, it's not difficult to see the
> market benefit here.
>
> So, this is a lesson in belaboring the obvious.
> Now, what are your trying
> to get at, and does it affect anyone movement
> towards their goal?
>
> Scott
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nobody@groupstudy.com
> [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
> Dillon Yang
> Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 7:27 AM
> To: cciein2006@yahoo.com; ccielab@groupstudy.com
> Subject: Re: Three Test Minimum?
>
> 1. Questionable grading
> So many candidates in the list questioned the CCIE
> lab exam, so, lets
> analyze it now.
>
> 2. Indubitable facts
> 2.1. the Quarterly Income Statement of
> cisco(values in millions),
> $5,926 7/31/2004
> $5,971 10/30/2004
> $6,062 1/29/2005
> $6,187 4/30/2005
>
http://quotes.nasdaq.com/asp/MasterDataEntry.asp?page=full
> symbol="csco"
> 2.2. The Total of Routing and Switching
> CCIEs(valid):
> 11228 8/1/2004
> 11434 11/1/2004
> 11629 2/1/2005
> 11701 5/1/2005
> 12007 8/1/2005
>
http://www.cisco.com/web/learning/le3/ccie/certified_ccies/worldwide.html
>
>
> 2.3. Gold Certification Requirements: One
> additional CCIE for each $40
> million in annual Cisco revenue(4 CCIE minimum, Add
> 1 per $40 million in
> revenue )
>
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/learning/le3/le2/le37/le10/learning_certification
> _type_home.html
>
>
> 2.4. There is 10 lab exam location all over the
> world.
>
http://www.cisco.com/web/learning/le3/ccie/rs/scheduling_lab_exam.html
> 2.5. The nominal increase is 100 CCIE per month.
> The number should be
> 100.8 from 7/14/2004 to 5/13/2005, that is
> 1008/10month.For the other
> track's
> sake, 100 is ok.
> R&S ccie number date
> 14645 5/13/2005
> 14551 4/7/2005
> 14351 2/19/2005
> 14251 12/9/2004
> 14063 11/8/2004
> 13949 10/18/2004
> 13746 8/2/2004
> 13637 7/14/2004
> http://www.netmasterclass.net &
> http://www.cisco.com/"CCIE Verification
> Tool"
> 2.6. There are many trick in real lab
> exam.(personal experiences)
> 2.7. The granularity of grading is coarse. Since
> there are a lot of
> noticeable points in a subsection, its score always
> between 2 and 4.
> (personal experiences)
>
> 3. Inferences:
> 3.1. There is relation between the number of
> CCIE and the Income of
> CISCO. The date 8/1/2004 and the date 7/31/2004 are
> approximately equal,
> then we have a compatible point that have a 11228
> and a 5926. So, the 6187
> has a ratio of 1.044043 to 5926 and the 11701 has a
> ratio of 1.042127 to
> 11228. This means that in the 9 months the increases
> of the CCIE number and
> the Income are the same stationary speed, that is
> about 0.47 percents per
> month on average.
> 3.2. There is a minimum workload of a CCIE
> complied by cisco. Based on
> 2.1 and 2.2 and 3.1, we can figure out it by the
> Quarterly Income Statement
> of cisco and the number of CCIE, for example, it
> equals 5926 millions USD
> per 11228 CCIE, i.e. about 5800 USD/CCIE/day. Can we
> guess that if you can
> FINISH the configuration of 5800 USDs of devices for
> a certain complexity in
>
> a working day, then you are eligible to be a CCIE?
> In other words, a CCIE
> thats annual income is 100K USD earns 274 USD per
> day, that means the
> maintaining fee for cisco products is 274/5800, i.e.
> 4.72%. If annual 60K,
> then 2.83%.
> 3.3. There is a maximum workload of a CCIE
> complied by cisco. Based on
> 2.3, we can figure out 40 million per year is 109589
> USD/CCIE/day. i.e.
> cisco will not allow any CCIE to finish his job more
> than 110K USD in a
> working day even if he believes he can.
> 3.4. There is stationary increase in number of
> CCIE. Based on 2.2 and
> 3.1, we can figure out the average
> increase(excluding the invalid) per month
>
> is 11228*0.47%, i.e. 52.6 CCIEs in recent months.
> That is need by the
> increase of Income.
> 3.5. The pass rate is about 0.08333. The minimum
> of seats is 4 and the
> maximum is 16, say, the average is 8 for the 10
> location. The proctors work
> 5 days per week and the usage of seats may be 70%,
> then there are
> 8*10*(30*5/7)*0.7 seats per month, i.e. 1200
> candidates per month(We have no
>
> knowledge about the actual candidates per month, it
> may be from
> 4seats*10*30*5/7 to 10seats*10*30*5/7 ). So, based
> on 2.5 and this, the pass
>
> rate is 100/1200, i.e. 8.33%. Or between 100/857 and
> 100/2142, i.e. 11.7%
> and 4.7%. And, the actual number of candidates for
> CCIE is unknown.
> 3.6. Obviously, a fine granular grading will
> figure your image well. Why
>
> not do you select 640*480 resolution for your
> screen, instead, you prefer
> the 1024*768, or more? Because the latter has more
> detailed information that
>
> can please you. So, based 2.7, the coarse granular
> grading neglects your
> endeavor on many dimensions to lower your scores.
> 3.7. The more tricks, the more failures. In
> probability theory, say, the
>
> probability for you to make a successful hit is
> PT(1) equals 0.95, then the
> continuous two successful hit is PT(2) equals 0.95^2
> equals 0.90, the PT(3)
> equals 0.86, the PT(5) equals 0.77. For CCIE, you
> fail now. For example,
> 1st,you are asked to make a OSPF virtual-link
> between R2 and R3, its so
> simple and you have probability of 95% that makes
> you happy.
> Then, 2nd, the R3 reaches the area 0 and area 23,
> the R2 reaches the area 23
>
> and the area 2. Now you are not asked to do OSPF-VL,
> but it implies this.
> The probability changes to 90% but you still happy.
> Then 3rd, the R3 and R2 reach the area 0 and there
> is no routing protocol
> between them. You know the default route is not
> allowed, the probability
> descends to 86% now, but you finally done it by PBR.
> As far as OK, 4th, the R3 and R2 reach the area 0
> and there is no routing
> protocol between them, you are not allowed to use
> default route and
>
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