Re: cisco lab safe

Very true, very true... Not sure about R&S, I haven't heard anything.
But I've been hearing rumors that the CCIE Security class is taught by a
CCSP. *shrug*

Narbik Kocharians wrote:
> Sorry Scott, i thought you were talking about me; Well, who cares about what
> he says? Does he offer R&S these days?
>
> On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 6:45 PM, Michael Jones <majonestx_at_gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>> ****waits for someone to come in and spin this convo into how the OEQ arent
>> fair.
>>
>> :)
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 8:32 PM, Terry Vinson <consultant_at_tnclimited.com
>>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> When it's all said and done. We all know who makes CCIE's. A student
>>>
>> with
>>
>>> a desire to endure the marathon (gauntlet), and the
>>>
>> instructor/instructors
>>
>>> that make all the difference for them. NO amount of corporate
>>>
>> positioning
>>
>>> is going to change that. No amount of marketing is going to make someone
>>> internalize (and know) this amount of information in half the time it
>>>
>> takes
>>
>>> now. What works for some will not work for others. There is no cookie
>>> cutter program that will ever turn out the caliber of CCIE's that Narbik,
>>> IPexpert and INE have made separately to date.
>>>
>>> Diversity is strength in this business.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Scott Morris wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> You weren't on the original distribution, or the writer of the direct
>>>> e-mail I was replying to... So I don't think so. ;)
>>>>
>>>> It's all good. Fun to watch.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *Scott Morris*, CCIE/x4/ (R&S/ISP-Dial/Security/Service Provider) #4713,
>>>>
>>>> JNCIE-M #153, JNCIS-ER, CISSP, et al.
>>>>
>>>> JNCI-M, JNCI-ER
>>>>
>>>> evil_at_ine.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Internetwork Expert, Inc.
>>>>
>>>> http://www.InternetworkExpert.com <http://www.internetworkexpert.com/>
>>>>
>>>> Toll Free: 877-224-8987
>>>>
>>>> Outside US: 775-826-4344
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Knowledge is power.
>>>>
>>>> Power corrupts.
>>>>
>>>> Study hard and be Eeeeviiiil......
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Narbik Kocharians wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I am sorry Scott, who are you talking to? are you talking to me? Who is
>>>>> breaking NDA?
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 5:07 PM, Scott Morris <smorris_at_ine.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> It's not only not "fair" (isn't all fair in love, war and marketing?)
>>>>>> but it's also not accurate. Some of us merely adhere to NDAs better
>>>>>> than others do, and don't attempt to rub noses in things.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But it's all in the name of fun, right?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *Scott Morris*, CCIE/x4/ (R&S/ISP-Dial/Security/Service Provider)
>>>>>>
>> #4713,
>>
>>>>>> JNCIE-M #153, JNCIS-ER, CISSP, et al.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> JNCI-M, JNCI-ER
>>>>>>
>>>>>> evil_at_ine.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Internetwork Expert, Inc.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.InternetworkExpert.com<http://www.internetworkexpert.com/><
>>>>>>
>> http://www.internetworkexpert.com/>
>>
>>>>>> Toll Free: 877-224-8987
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Outside US: 775-826-4344
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Knowledge is power.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Power corrupts.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Study hard and be Eeeeviiiil......
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dark Fiber wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I can't see that being fair to bring up right now... What does that
>>>>>>> tell people who want to get started today? Wait "X" amount of time
>>>>>>> because their is a change coming down the line? If there is a major
>>>>>>> change coming down the line why isn't this being told to us right
>>>>>>>
>> now?
>>
>>>>>>> On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 7:03 PM, Brad Ellis <brad_at_ccbootcamp.com
>>>>>>> <mailto:brad_at_ccbootcamp.com>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Scott is comparing a grey-market program to the Cisco authorized
>>>>>>>
>> 360
>>
>>>>>>> learning program. There are some major changes coming to the CCIE
>>>>>>> lab
>>>>>>> exam. The Cisco 360 Program already has the "inside scoop" on the
>>>>>>> changes coming down the pipe. The grey market folks don't have
>>>>>>> that. If
>>>>>>> you want to prepare for your lab exam properly, it's going to
>>>>>>>
>> become
>>
>>>>>>> more and more apparent that the 360 program is the way to go. (One
>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>> the big reasons why we joined the program!)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This announcement is only one of many things to come. There will
>>>>>>> be more
>>>>>>> and more differentiators that keep making the Cisco 360 Learning
>>>>>>> Program
>>>>>>> increasingly advantageous as the best option for CCIE training
>>>>>>> over grey
>>>>>>> market competition.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> thanks,
>>>>>>> Brad Ellis
>>>>>>> CCIE#5796 (R&S / Security)
>>>>>>> CCSI# 30482
>>>>>>> CEO / President
>>>>>>> CCBOOTCAMP - Cisco Learning Solutions Partner (CLSP)
>>>>>>> Email: brad_at_ccbootcamp.com <mailto:brad_at_ccbootcamp.com>
>>>>>>> Toll Free: 877-654-2243
>>>>>>> International: +1-702-968-5100
>>>>>>> Skype: skype:ccbootcamp?call
>>>>>>> FAX: +1-702-446-8012
>>>>>>> YES! We take Cisco Learning Credits!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: nobody_at_groupstudy.com <mailto:nobody_at_groupstudy.com>
>>>>>>> [mailto:nobody_at_groupstudy.com <mailto:nobody_at_groupstudy.com>] On
>>>>>>> Behalf Of
>>>>>>> Scott Morris
>>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 3:41 PM
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> > To: armylegionmedic_at_aol.com <mailto:armylegionmedic_at_aol.com>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Cc: darkfiber08_at_gmail.com <mailto:darkfiber08_at_gmail.com>;
>>>>>>> dane.newman_at_gmail.com <mailto:dane.newman_at_gmail.com>;
>>>>>>> ccielab_at_groupstudy.com <mailto:ccielab_at_groupstudy.com>
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: cisco lab safe
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Excellent question on that. The CCIE Essentials, though, is
>>>>>>>
>> exactly
>>
>>>>>>> that from them, the workbooks + videos. So I was putting out the
>>>>>>> option. It simply happened to be the least expensive option from
>>>>>>> us.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> By the way, according to
>>>>>>> https://cisco.hosted.jivesoftware.com/docs/DOC-5857, I was
>>>>>>> incorrect on
>>>>>>> my math. You must take ALL FOUR (4 x 349 = $1,400) AND score at
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> least
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 80% on one of them. So their minimum investment just became
>>>>>>>
>> $3,995
>>
>>>>>>> +
>>>>>>> $1,400 = $5,395.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Slice it however you want. It's marketing, and I most certainly
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> won't
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> fault anyone for that! As always, people are capable of making
>>>>>>> their
>>>>>>> own decisions on things! Just do the math.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm not downplaying the program itself. I know too many of the
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> people
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> involved and respect their capabilities all around. Not all
>>>>>>>
>> vendors
>>
>>>>>>> selling the 360 will be the same, however, which puts a kludge
>>>>>>>
>> into
>>
>>>>>>> things... but as long as you know what you're getting into, you
>>>>>>>
>> are
>>
>>>>>>> welcome to select whichever flavor of apple works best for you!
>>>>>>> Some
>>>>>>> may be more expensive than others despite the pretty sign next to
>>>>>>> them!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ;)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Scott Morris*, CCIE/x4/ (R&S/ISP-Dial/Security/Service Provider)
>>>>>>> #4713,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> JNCIE-M #153, JNCIS-ER, CISSP, et al.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> JNCI-M, JNCI-ER
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> evil_at_ine.com <mailto:evil_at_ine.com>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Internetwork Expert, Inc.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://www.InternetworkExpert.com<http://www.internetworkexpert.com/>
>>>>>>>
>> <
>>
>>>>>>> http://www.internetworkexpert.com/>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Toll Free: 877-224-8987
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Outside US: 775-826-4344
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Knowledge is power.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Power corrupts.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Study hard and be Eeeeviiiil......
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> armylegionmedic_at_aol.com <mailto:armylegionmedic_at_aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> > I mean, maybe this is just me, but the only price that was cheap
>>>>>>> > enough to beat Cisco's deal was a CoD and Workkooks, so we arent
>>>>>>> > really comparing Apples to Apples are we? If we were to look
>>>>>>> apples to
>>>>>>> > apples or maybe like a Granny Smith vs. Mt. Washington Apple, I
>>>>>>> think
>>>>>>> > that the Cisco 360 offer is looking pretty tempting. The only
>>>>>>>
>> part
>>
>>>>>>> > that I would have to really say competes is the free re-sits.
>>>>>>> This is
>>>>>>> > all IMO, but maybe I am misreading something.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> > From: Dark Fiber <darkfiber08_at_gmail.com
>>>>>>> <mailto:darkfiber08_at_gmail.com>>
>>>>>>> > To: Scott Morris <smorris_at_ine.com <mailto:smorris_at_ine.com>>
>>>>>>> > Cc: Dane Newman <dane.newman_at_gmail.com
>>>>>>> <mailto:dane.newman_at_gmail.com>>; Cisco certification
>>>>>>> > <ccielab_at_groupstudy.com <mailto:ccielab_at_groupstudy.com>>
>>>>>>> > Sent: Tue, Sep 15, 2009 3:25 pm
>>>>>>> > Subject: Re: cisco lab safe
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > If I read that right $3500 and the price of a mock lab might be
>>>>>>> worth
>>>>>>> it for
>>>>>>> > a $1400 lab voucher if you fail. Anyone else get the same or did
>>>>>>>
>> I
>>
>>>>>>> misread
>>>>>>> > it?
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Scott Morris <smorris_at_ine.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> > <mailto:smorris_at_ine.com>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > > Ok.... So let's do some math on this...
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > CIERS1 = $3,995
>>>>>>> > > CIERS2 = $4,500
>>>>>>> > > Essentials = $4,550
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > Plus an Assessment lab (minimum 1, possibly more) = $349
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > So at a BARE MINIMUM you are looking at $3,995 + $349 = $4,345
>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>> > > have to spend in order to get that.
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > For INE's pricing, a bootcamp costs $2,995 (not including any
>>>>>>> > > discounts). The mock lab workshop is $3,995 again not
>>>>>>>
>> counting
>>
>>>>>>> > > discounts. The lab workbook set + CoD bundle = $825 + 1,695
>>>>>>>
>> or
>>
>>>>>>> $2,520
>>>>>>> > > (not including any discounts). A mock lab (minimum 1,
>>>>>>>
>> possibly
>>
>>>>>>> more) =
>>>>>>> > > $129.
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > So on price point alone, you have a minimum comparable
>>>>>>> spending (not
>>>>>>> > > including discounts) of $2,649. That's a grand difference
>>>>>>> there of
>>>>>>> > > $1,696, so you can spring for another lab, not need
>>>>>>> pre-qualification
>>>>>>> > > AND save an extra $296 to use towards your
>>>>>>> airfare/hotel/food/whatever....
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > Oh yeah, and you don't get re-sits in the 360 program, you can
>>>>>>> attend
>>>>>>> > > our classes as many times as you'd like to and whenever you'd
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> like
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> to.
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > So I'm really thinking that this kind of promotion alone is
>>>>>>>
>> not
>>
>>>>>>> going to
>>>>>>> > > swing someone one way or the other, at least unless they don't
>>>>>>> do
>>>>>>> math.
>>>>>>> > > But I'm sure if you work with our sales department, we would
>>>>>>> be more
>>>>>>> > > than happy to charge you more money and simply spring for a
>>>>>>>
>> lab
>>
>>>>>>> attempt
>>>>>>> > > for you based on certain criteria and select vendors only.
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > If you have any questions on this, feel free to contact me
>>>>>>> offline,
>>>>>>> I'd
>>>>>>> > > be more than happy to cover options with you. I don't see a
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> point
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>> > > dragging this on and on through a technical list (e.g.
>>>>>>> non-marketing
>>>>>>> list).
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > *Scott Morris*, CCIE/x4/ (R&S/ISP-Dial/Security/Service
>>>>>>> Provider)
>>>>>>> #4713,
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > JNCIE-M #153, JNCIS-ER, CISSP, et al.
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > JNCI-M, JNCI-ER
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > evil_at_ine.com <mailto:evil_at_ine.com>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > Internetwork Expert, Inc.
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > http://www.InternetworkExpert.com<http://www.internetworkexpert.com/>
>>>>>>>
>> <
>>
>>>>>>> http://www.internetworkexpert.com/>
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > Toll Free: 877-224-8987
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > Outside US: 775-826-4344
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > Knowledge is power.
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > Power corrupts.
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > Study hard and be Eeeeviiiil......
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > Dane Newman wrote:
>>>>>>> > > > I got the following email below from cisco. All I can say
>>>>>>> is imo
>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>> > > will
>>>>>>> > > > make it harder on 3rd party vendors sadly that do offer
>>>>>>> quality
>>>>>>> training.
>>>>>>> > > > The chance to retake the lab for free is worth its weight in
>>>>>>> gold
>>>>>>> for all
>>>>>>> > > > the stress relief it can bring.
>>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>>> > > > Dane
>>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>>> > > > Cisco Lab Safe Promotion: Protect Your Training Investment
>>>>>>> > > > Learning_at_Cisco is pleased to introduce the Cisco Lab Safe
>>>>>>> promotion. The
>>>>>>> > > > Cisco Lab Safe promotion allows qualifying Cisco. 360
>>>>>>>
>> Learning
>>
>>>>>>> Program
>>>>>>> > > for
>>>>>>> > > > CCIE. Routing & Switching students who don't pass their
>>>>>>> first CCIE
>>>>>>> lab
>>>>>>> > > exam
>>>>>>> > > > attempt, to retake the CCIE lab exam (a $1,400 US Value) at
>>>>>>>
>> no
>>
>>>>>>> additional
>>>>>>> > > > cost.
>>>>>>> > > > The Cisco 360 Learning Program for R&S guides engineers who
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> have
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> three to
>>>>>>> > > > five years of networking experience through an effective,
>>>>>>> job-relevant,
>>>>>>> > > and
>>>>>>> > > > proven program to build expert-level skills and to prepare
>>>>>>> for the
>>>>>>> > > rigorous
>>>>>>> > > > Cisco CCIE R&S certification exams. Together, the Cisco
>>>>>>>
>> 360
>>
>>>>>>> Learning
>>>>>>> > > > Program for CCIE R&S and the Cisco Lab Safe promotion
>>>>>>>
>> provide
>>
>>>>>>> added
>>>>>>> > > > assurance in the quality and value of your training
>>>>>>> investment.
>>>>>>> > > > How the Cisco Lab Safe Promotion Works:
>>>>>>> > > > Students must meet the following criteria in order to be
>>>>>>> eligible
>>>>>>> for the
>>>>>>> > > > Cisco Lab Safe promotion:
>>>>>>> > > > A recommendation from their instructor
>>>>>>> > > > Completed the Cisco 360 Learning Program for CCIE R&S
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Essentials
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Package
>>>>>>> > > or
>>>>>>> > > > a CIERS instructor-led workshop
>>>>>>> > > > Scored 80% or better on one of the CIERS 1-4 performance
>>>>>>> assessments
>>>>>>> > > > Only select Authorized Cisco Learning Partners offer the
>>>>>>> Cisco 360
>>>>>>> > > Learning
>>>>>>> > > > Program curriculum and Cisco Lab Safe promotion.
>>>>>>> > > > Find out more about Cisco Lab Safe promotion and the
>>>>>>>
>> official
>>
>>>>>>> terms and
>>>>>>> > > > conditions on the Cisco Learning Network.
>>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>>> > > > Subscribe to CiscoUnsubscribe from CiscoPrivacy Statement
>>>>>>> > > > Subscribe to receive emails and newsletters from Cisco.
>>>>>>> > > > Or modify your profile, subscriptions, and preferences if
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> you're
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> already
>>>>>>> > > a
>>>>>>> > > > Cisco customer.To no longer receive these messages from
>>>>>>>
>> Cisco.
>>
>>>>>>> Please
>>>>>>> > > allow
>>>>>>> > > > 7-10 business days for changes to take effect.Read more
>>>>>>> about our
>>>>>>> privacy
>>>>>>> > > > statement.
>>>>>>> > > > Please do not reply to this email for support. To view
>>>>>>> answers to
>>>>>>> > > commonly
>>>>>>> > > > asked questions regarding the Cisco Certification Program or
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>> request
>>>>>>> > > > assistance related to this email, visit the Certification
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Online
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Support
>>>>>>> > > > tool at www.cisco.com/go/certsupport
>>>>>>> <http://www.cisco.com/go/certsupport>.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> > > > >
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> > > > Copyright (C) 2008, Cisco Systems, Inc. All rights reserved.
>>>>>>> Cisco, the
>>>>>>> > > > Cisco logo, and Cisco Systems are registered trademarks of
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cisco
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Systems,
>>>>>>> > > > Inc. and/or its affiliates in the United States and certain
>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>> > > countries.
>>>>>>> > > > Cisco Systems, Inc. 170 West Tasman Drive, San Jose,
>>>>>>> California
>>>>>>> 95134
>>>>>>> > > ATTN:
>>>>>>> > > > Corporate Marketing (SJC08/3/4)
>>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>>> > > > Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>> _______________________________________________________________________
>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> > > > Subscription information may be found at:
>>>>>>> > > > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > > Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>> _______________________________________________________________________
>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> > > Subscription information may be found at:
>>>>>>> > > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>> _______________________________________________________________________
>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> > Subscription information may be found at:
>>>>>>> > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>> _______________________________________________________________________
>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Subscription information may be found at:
>>>>>>> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>> _______________________________________________________________________
>>
>>>>>> Subscription information may be found at:
>>>>>> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________________________________
>>>> Subscription information may be found at:
>>>> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________________________________
>>> Subscription information may be found at:
>>> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>>>
>> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>
>> _______________________________________________________________________
>> Subscription information may be found at:
>> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html

Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
Received on Wed Sep 16 2009 - 00:01:05 ART