Re: Petition: Revamp or Replace OEQ

Now see this is viable solution to the problem.

1. Registered Lab Attendees have the same limitations as lab candidates.

2. Pre-Lab 3-6 months before a lab date (6 months seems more practical).

3. Adminstration Cost - Say $125-200 for the 30 minute test.

4. No repeat questions.

5. No reference materials.

6. Maybe scratch #1 and if you fail the OEQ Mini-Test - Take is a warning to
go back and study for 4-6 months.

Other ideas?

On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 1:35 PM, Scott Morris <smorris_at_ine.com> wrote:

> Statistics. The object isn't to test your knowledge of the entire
> blueprint, just a subset thereof.
>
> If it were done the way >I< would design it, you'd get some initial
> questions, and if you failed them, you wouldn't even be able to see the rest
> of the lab. THAT would solve the braindump problem. But wouldn't that piss
> you off even more, to go, and 30 minutes later you're kicked out?
>
> On the bright side, you get the see the entire lab, and you'll get to see
> exactly what/how things are being asked. The next time you'll pass.
>
> People have this problem with written tests all the time. The thing that
> makes this format harder is that it isn't "multiple guess". That, and when
> people fail a $125 test, they're irritated, but not quite as much!
>
> Scott
>
>
>
>
> Nadeem Rafi wrote:
>
> why only 4 questions.... its quite unfair. questions should be gone as for
> dumpers troubleshooting can do the trick. If these are not gone then at
> least should be increased so that a question should not cost 1400 USD which
> in many countries is more than few months salary.
> just few thoughts....
>
>
> On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 8:11 PM, Scott Morris <smorris_at_ine.com> <smorris_at_ine.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> Let's not be too far off the beaten path here...
>
> First of all, missing one question is just fine. Missing two will cause
> you to have an expensive lunch. So keep with the accurate program here
> (Maurilio had these details long ago).
>
> Now, I may be part of the minority (and arguable since I don't have to
> take them), but I am in favor of the OEQs. I think the idea is very
> much worthwhile.
>
> Now, I sit back and hear a lot about the quality of the questions from
> people, and see the folks who SHOULD be passing yet are not, which
> indicates a problem. But it's one that's simple to fix as part of a QA
> process from Cisco. (That's not Question/Answer by the way)
>
> If you have QUALITY questions, they can achieve the goal needed, and can
> easily be argued that those who miss them do so based on techincal merit
> rather than some other absurd reason.
>
> Boycotting's an interesting idea, but unless you have some plan to reach
> EVERYONE out there and make a serious impact the quantity of people from
> GS going will merely make it look like a statistical blip.
>
> But if everyone who feels wronged by the OEQs files a certification
> support ticket, it will force the group to review the questions, and any
> anomolies or "bad questions" will be more easily recognized by the "in
> your face"escalation process.
>
> Just my two cents. (As opposed to $1,400)
>
> Scott
>
>
> Darby Weaver wrote:
>
>
> Well we could just say that...
>
> However, Cisco is a Marketing Company and is a For-Profit Company and the
> CCIE Program has become a profit-making venture.
>
> I think the term Boycott is a bit stronger and has a little more effect.
>
> When the number of CCIE's available for Cisco Partners starts to turn
> NEGATIVE...
>
> Cisco has a choice, either Get Rid of the OEQ...
>
> OR...
>
> REVAMP the Cisco Partner Program...
>
> Maybe there is a 3rd Option... or 4th...
>
> But if there are no CCIE's... the CCDE is likely to take a tumble...
>
> No CCDE's what happens to the CCA?
>
>
> It's got quite the Domino-Effect...
>
> Let's see how many people active on this list care to voice their own
> opinions...
>
> Taking the CCIE Lab and Failing based on "One Question"... is ludicrous
>
>
> at
>
>
> best.
>
>
> There are 4 questions. 3 will earn a candidate 21 points...
>
> Lose 1 question more and you lose $1400.00 + Travel and Expenses.
>
> More in some countries as I understand it.
>
>
> $2000-2500.00 for 1 question?
>
> Excuse me but this is ABSURD!
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 12:49 PM, Mark Matters <markccie_at_gmail.com> <markccie_at_gmail.com>
>
> wrote:
>
>
> Your email looks like it's missing a few words, confusing.
> But I agree. GET RID OF THE OEQ
>
> On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 12:35 PM, Darby Weaver <darby.weaver_at_gmail.com
>
> wrote:
>
>
> Seems like we need a petition to make the point clear.
>
> Now if some of you guys don't think that some of the OEQ's are fair...
>
>
> I
>
>
> have to ask the question is repeating "Hearsay" even close the breaking
> the
> NDA?
>
> Because if I were to show you some questions that I've run across you
> might now find them so easy and if the instructors themselves can't
>
>
> find
>
>
> reasonable answers... in a reasonable time-frame... (Ummm....
>
>
> Candidates
>
>
> only get 30 minutes for 4 of these puppies and no use of Google.com
>
>
> btw).
>
>
> I've got to ask you? Who are we trying to get to pass the CCIE Lab?
>
> Disclaimer: See the first batch of OEQ. Straight forward mostly.
>
> If your questions start asking "Why"...
>
> You might as well just hand in your lab guide and catch your plane and
>
>
> go
>
>
> home... Unless you know you nailed them and did not second guess
> yourself.
>
>
>
>
> --
> Darby Weaver
> Network Engineer
>
> 407-802-7394darbyweaver_at_yahoo.com
>
>
> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>
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>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
>
> -
> "The more I learn the less I know". This is incredibly frustrating to
>
>
> me.
>
>
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>
> _______________________________________________________________________
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>
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>
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>
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-- 
Darby Weaver
Network Engineer
407-802-7394
darbyweaver_at_yahoo.com
Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net