From: Jamie Brogdon (jamie.brogdon@verizon.net)
Date: Sun May 11 2008 - 22:17:30 ART
NRF,
Can you please stop the tirade?
To be honest, nobody cares whether you are or are not an IE. Nobody
cares whether you think there should be a limited number of attempts.
Nobody cares whether you think the CCIE is less valuable than a college
degree. Basically, nobody cares!
Let's get back to the reason we are here... AND that is to do knowledge
transfer for folks who want to better themselves... THE END!
Jamie Brogdon
-----Original Message-----
From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
nrf
Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2008 3:43 AM
To: ccielab@groupstudy.com; comserv@groupstudy.com
Subject: Re: How to Become a CCIE v2
>What the difference if a person sits the CCIE Lab 20 times and then
>passes or
takes 20 - 30 Vendor >CCIE Labs and then passes in the first attempt.
I've seen people fail after using the vendors 20-30 labs >too on the
first try.
Pray tell, what exactly is a "vendor CCIE lab"? How exactly does one
pass a "vendor CCIE lab"?
Now, if you're referring to people using practice labs, then that's
really the answer to your question. They're PRACTICE, and by
definition, you don't really pass a "practice" lab because that's not a
real attempt. That would be like the Patriots saying that they won all
of their "practice" Superbowls, so now they deserve to win the actual
Superbowl. No, practice is practice. You practice to prepare to win
the real game.
Which leads, again, to the key difference that I have been illustrating.
You can "play" the real CCIE over and over again until they finally
pass. But the Patriots can't "play" the Superbowl over and over until
they finally win. Similarly, in the example you raised, you can't attend
the Navy Nuclear Power program over and over until you finally pass.
>My point is that brute forcing a CCIE Lab need not mean that one simply
>goes
to the CCIE Lab more than 1-3 >times. I assume there are more that 3,
6, or even 20 current CCIE Labs at any given time anyway. So what
>difference does it make?
I think I explained this quite clearly before - please read my posts
again. Like I said, if you keep taking the exam over and over again, you
are eventually going to get a version of the test that asks you
questions that you know well (and doesn't ask you questions that you
don't know well). Either that, or you are going to get a version that
you've seen before. It's a simple matter of statistics.
>What's the difference? Please explain. There is some value to
becoming a
CCIE or people would not >even both taking the lab more than once
anyway, would they?
I never said there was no value in becoming a CCIE. In fact, it is
PRECISELY because there is value in the process is why people are
spending time debating these points. After all, why debate something
that has no value anyway?
The issue is that the ability to take the exam infinite times DEVALUES
the process. If Cisco were to place reasonable limits to the number of
attempts,
then the process would be MORE valuable. Having infinite attempts
inevitably
means that some people are simply not going to prepare properly,
figuring that they might get lucky, and even if they don't, who cares,
it's not that much money and not that much time anyway, a notion that is
exacerbated if your employer is paying.
>NRF are you a CCIE?
Does it matter?
Let me put it to you this way. Let's say I had in fact passed the CCIE.
Would you now change your mind? Be honest.
If the honest answer is no, you wouldn't change your mind, then it
doesn't really matter if I'm a CCIE, now does it?
----- Original Message -----
From: Isabella Figarella
To: Ernest McCaleb
Cc: nrf ; ccielab@groupstudy.com ; comserv@groupstudy.com
Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2008 3:08 AM
Subject: Re: How to Become a CCIE v2
NRF,
What the difference if a person sits the CCIE Lab 20 times and then
passes or takes 20 - 30 Vendor CCIE Labs and then passes in the first
attempt. I've seen people fail after using the vendors 20-30 labs too
on the first try.
My point is that brute forcing a CCIE Lab need not mean that one
simply goes to the CCIE Lab more than 1-3 times. I assume there are
more that 3, 6, or even 20 current CCIE Labs at any given time anyway.
So what difference does it make?
What's the difference? Please explain. There is some value to
becoming a
CCIE or people would not even both taking the lab more than once anyway,
would they?
NRF are you a CCIE?
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