From: tan (tan@dia.janis.or.jp)
Date: Mon Feb 24 2003 - 03:56:13 GMT-3
I think any faq of the sort about lab gotchas or tips is going to be an
endless thankless task. I don't mean to steal anyone's thunder, but what is
considered a tip/gotcha is different per person and what is pertinent
changes throughout time. I have seen commercial study notes, and it is the
same problem,...what is considered a "gee, wow" point of interest in the
last few weeks of somebody's CCIE prep (which is usually the criteria for
what defines a big tip), could be considered "eh, I knew that, doyle p.xx"
by someone else. Personally, I just like the one-off "here's a tip"
approach, rather than an organized structure.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com]On Behalf Of
> Jim Brown
> Sent: Monday, February 24, 2003 9:19 AM
> To: Jerry; OhioHondo; ray_gan74@hotmail.com; Sean;
> ccielab@groupstudy.com
> Subject: RE: Suggestion - FAQ of CCIE Lab
>
>
> Think about this.
>
> If they take the lab and can't figure out the solution after their lab
> date and must ask the list for the answer..... They must REALLY REALLY
> stink as an engineer.
>
> OR
>
> If a candidate receives some information about a real lab and
> they can't
> figure out the solution before they take lab on their own and must ask
> the list...... They will REALLY REALLY REALLY stink as an engineer.
>
> I busted my butt and it chaps my hide to see questions pop up on the
> list, but what are you going to do? You only do more damage
> by pointing
> out it is an NDA violation. Hopefully the cheaters will fall flat on
> their face in the real world. I can hope for karma.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jerry [mailto:phase90@comcast.net]
> Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 4:21 PM
> To: OhioHondo; ray_gan74@hotmail.com; Sean; ccielab@groupstudy.com
> Subject: Re: Suggestion - FAQ of CCIE Lab
>
>
> Gentlemen [ and lady or 2 ] ,
>
> This may be a stupid question but here goes. Why
> don't
> the questions on this list violate the CCIE NDA. I have only taken the
> lab
> once but I know there are several different real labs
> that must be rotated in and out in some fasion. The first time I read
> the
> list the day after I took my
> lab I saw the exact same questions that were on my lab. This
> would mean
> either someone else at RTP
> or possiblt another lab had the exact same scenario as I did. This is
> what I
> wonder. Why isn't the
> whole list an NDA violation? Please exaplain at anyone's convenience.
>
>
> Jerry
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: OhioHondo <ohiohondo@columbus.rr.com>
> To: <ray_gan74@hotmail.com>; Sean <groupstudyccielab@datalion.com>;
> <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
> Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 2:33 PM
> Subject: RE: Suggestion - FAQ of CCIE Lab
>
>
> > I think the FAQ idea is a good one, however..... I also
> believe there
> is
> > another issue. Teaching/Instructing is a darn good way to
> learn -- to
> > solidify your thoughts on a subject and express them to another.
> >
> > Everyone on this forum is in a different place in their CCIE lab
> > preparation. For those on the last legs of their study preparation,
> these
> > "simple", oft answered questions might be an annoyance. To
> others they
> are
> a
> > learning opportunity both the the one who asks the question and the
> one(s)
> > who answer it. Seeing others' points of view on a subject, or seeing
> where
> > our study partners might be mis-directed so we can help or
> "answering
> a
> > question" and being corrected by someone who has a better
> grasp of the
> > technology -- these are all valuable.
> >
> > I agree that some of the questioners should do more
> research prior to
> asking
> > their questions. They should not take the easy way out and expect a
> total
> > explanation of a technology to come from this forum. (Incidentally,
> this
> > approach probably confuses them rather than help because of the
> multitude
> of
> > answers that are typically given.) But I also believe that anyone
> should
> be
> > allowed to ask any question --- for all of the good reasons
> mentioned
> above.
> >
> > Note --- It's not the questions that are the majority of the e-mails
> that
> I
> > receive from this forum. It's the multitude of answers, requests for
> > clarification on a question, etc. In other words, it's the ones that
> are
> > trying to help, or the ones that are trying to discuss that are
> creating
> the
> > majority of the e-mails. This is not necessarily a bad thing --
> however
> > e-mail is not a good media for holding discussions.
> >
> > Here is another scenario that causes extended strings on a single
> string.
> I
> > have been guilty of causing this one. Sometimes a question
> is too open
> ended
> > (not specific enough)and I provide an answer that is not complete or
> cover
> > all the possibilities -- because I don't take the time to cover all
> the
> > possibilites on the open ended question. I have to applaud
> people like
> Kym
> > Blair who consistantly take the time to first clarify the
> question and
> then
> > give a full answer to these queries. (There are others but Kym is a
> great
> > example.) Giving complete answers cuts down on the entire
> discussion.
> >
> > Just one more time --- the majority of the e-mails are answers to
> questions.
> > Some of the answers are just comraderie, friendly banter, between
> ourselves.
> > This social aspect of the forum, between all of those 'bleeding'
> through
> > their CCIE preparation, also has a value.
> >
> > With the CCO, archives and all the other resources
> available for study
> --
> > the CCIE groupstudy has its' place. Adding a FAQ's, that
> has accurate
> and
> > complete explanations, can't be a bad thing. But it is redundant to
> many
> > other possible sources of non-interactive information. (Well e-mail,
> pseudo
> > interactive)
> >
> > Just my 2 cents.........
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: nobody@groupstudy.com
[mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com]On Behalf Of
> ray_gan74@hotmail.com
> Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 11:53 AM
> To: Sean; ccielab@groupstudy.com
> Subject: Re: Suggestion - FAQ of CCIE Lab
>
>
> I think its a great idea! That way if there is a question that has
been
> answered many times before we can just refer them to the FAQ. In
addition
> we won't see anymore pissed off threads why people always ask the same
> question.
>
>
> Ray
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Sean" <groupstudyccielab@datalion.com>
> To: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
> Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 7:05 AM
> Subject: Suggestion - FAQ of CCIE Lab
>
>
> > Since many on the list think subscribers should search and/or
research
> more
> > instead of asking same basic question repeatedly, I suggest we
compile
an
> > FAQ for CCIE Lab takers. It should be posted to this list
frequently,
say
> > every month or quarter depending on the resource we have.
> >
> > A few days ago, someone wanted to collect CCIE Lab gotcha, and those
study
> > points can be good candidate for the FAQ. What do you think?
> >
> > Sean
> > CCIE 90XX
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