From: Tony Schaffran (tschaffran@cconlinelabs.com)
Date: Thu Feb 13 2003 - 17:43:14 GMT-3
I cannot speak for other study groups, but our study group is held at the
local cisco office with cisco employees attending and extra effort has been
made not to compromise the content of the lab. We are very concerned about
maintaining the integrity of the CCIE certification program. We do not want
to be considered a CCIE mill.
Tony Schaffran
Network Analyst
CCIE #11071
CCNP, CCNA, CCDA,
NNCSS, NNCDS, CNE, MCSE
www.cconlinelabs.com
"Your #1 choice for Cisco rack rentals."
----- Original Message -----
From: "c ," <ccie1@hotmail.com>
To: <tschaffran@cconlinelabs.com>; <msnyder@revolutioncomputer.com>;
<ccie8776@rochester.rr.com>
Cc: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 12:06 PM
Subject: RE: It is my turn. CCIE #11071
> I think having a study group makes all the difference. Its great to ask
> other people about stuff you dont understand. One thing i would say though
> for people who pass the FIRST time.
>
> If you have done it on your own without ANY input from anyone else, thats
> truely demonstrats dilligant study habits, but i have yet to hear about
> someone who has passed the first time who didnt ask questions from someone
> else who has already passed or is in progress of passing.
>
> You mentioned about a study group, and one thing i have noticed about
> studying with other people (especially ones who have taken the lab) is you
> get input about what mistakes they have made and what to watch out for, as
a
> result, you can figure out where they went wrong and know how to configure
> something on the lab.
>
> I think thats "how" the first timers do it. By getting enough info about
> what to watch out for and knowing how to configure it. Its those people
who
> have taken the lab before that make other people successful in my opinion.
I
> have taken the lab twice now, and will be going for my third attempt in
> April. Other people who i have shared my experience with have passed their
> second or first time too, but thats not because I read to deeply into the
> topics, its because i explained where i had some confusion on the lab or
> didnt know how to do something and we all figured it out together. It just
> so happens they were given a similar scenerio that I had and knew how to
> configure it.
>
> Now, if only i can find someone who has passed the lab that understands
some
> of the other topics I had problems with. ;)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >From: "Tony Schaffran" <tschaffran@cconlinelabs.com>
> >Reply-To: "Tony Schaffran" <tschaffran@cconlinelabs.com>
> >To: "'Michael Snyder'" <msnyder@revolutioncomputer.com>, "'Chuck
> >Church'" <ccie8776@rochester.rr.com>
> >CC: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
> >Subject: RE: It is my turn. CCIE #11071
> >Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 21:03:44 -0800
> >
> >First off, thank you.
> >
> >Second, I have made an observation within our study group. This may
> >hold true for a number of people. There are a couple of people in our
> >group that are obviously very knowledgeable about all of the topics
> >covered in the CCIE certification. One took three times to pass and the
> >other has taken it five times and still does not have his number. It is
> >my feeling that these individuals have tried to read toooooo deep into
> >the requirements and over configured. Remember, they are testing your
> >knowledge of the technologies, not your design skills. All I did is
> >read the question and satisfy the requirement. I did not try to get
> >bonus points with any kind of fancy configs. I asked the proctor, there
> >is no extra credit. :) The lab I took was in no way to be considered
> >easy or less difficult. I credit my success to my dedication to
> >studies, my wife can attest to that, and knowing where to find what I
> >did not know on the documentation CD. If it is on the CD, why try to
> >memorize it?
> >
> >
> >Tony Schaffran
> >Network Analyst
> >CCIE #11071
> >CCNP, CCNA, CCDA,
> >NNCDS, NNCSS, CNE, MCSE
> >
> >www.cconlinelabs.com
> >Your #1 choice for online Cisco rack rentals.
> >
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
> >Michael Snyder
> >Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 8:16 PM
> >To: 'Chuck Church'
> >Cc: ccielab@groupstudy.com
> >Subject: RE: It is my turn. CCIE #11071
> >
> >I think we should burn first timers at the stake!
> >
> >Just kidding, congratulations on your number.
> >
> >Chuck, I've asked myself the same question.
> >
> >I think it's three factors that come into play.
> >
> >A) There are some very sharp people out there. When it comes to the
> >human brain, there's something to be said for raw processing power and
> >good memories.
> >
> >B) Not knowing too much and confusing the issues. I mean, if you only
> >know three ways of doing something, then chances are that at least one
> >of the ways is the answer the test requirement is looking for.
> >
> >What if you know five ways of during the same task? Now your odds of
> >getting the right answer drops. Don't forget each choice picked
> >snowballs from beginning of the lab to the end.
> >
> >Remember the email thread about low scores, I had the same problem on my
> >last attempt. My overall core knowledge should have been at least over
> >40%.
> >
> >What if you rule out the correct answer early on the test, because it's
> >a poor design choice? Real world expertise could hurt in this regard.
> >
> >C) Pure luck, studying the right things and getting the right test with
> >the right proctor.
> >
> >Sure Cisco tries to normalize these things, but what if the proctor
> >just got a speeding ticket two hours before he grades your lab? It goes
> >the other way too, what if he just spent a great weekend with his family
> >in the mountains?
> >
> >Also if Cisco is changing tests on a monthly basis, random factors alone
> >would tell us that not all of new tests could be of the same
> >difficultly.
> >
> >Some requirements cut and pasted into a new exam could complement other
> >requirements making the overall exam easier; while other requirements on
> >a different exam could conflict and make the overall exam harder.
> >Standing wave theory is popping into my mind here.
> >
> >Even the best proctors couldn't catch such things till they looked at
> >the statistical data for that exam! Which by that time a new batch of
> >tests is being used.
> >
> >Why couldn't a proctor gauge the total difficultly of an exam before
> >they use it? Simple, because when you rate something as easy or
> >difficult or very complicated, you are using yourself as the reference
> >point.
> >
> >What if you know the subject material completely? Now you don't have
> >that reference point anymore. Everything is somewhat easy from your
> >standpoint.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
> >Chuck Church
> >Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 4:43 PM
> >To: Tony Schaffran; ccielab@groupstudy.com
> >Subject: Re: It is my turn. CCIE #11071
> >
> >Congratulations. I don't know how you "First-Attempters" do it, but you
> >certainly got the preparation down pat.
> >
> >Chuck Church
> >CCIE #8776, MCNE, MCSE
> >
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Tony Schaffran" <tschaffran@cconlinelabs.com>
> >To: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
> >Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 4:55 PM
> >Subject: It is my turn. CCIE #11071
> >
> >
> > > First of all, I would like to say thank you for all of the input on
> >this
> >list.
> > > Reading the problems and solutions and then trying them on my own has
> >given me
> > > great insight.
> > >
> > > Now for the path I have taken.
> > >
> > > 1. Many, many hours of hands on. You don't have to be fast, just
> >consistent.
> > >
> > > 2. I really liked the new IPexpert labs.
> > >
> > > 3. I learned the documentation CD inside and out. When I came across
> >an
> >issue
> > > I did not know, I knew exactly where to find it. One of my answers, I
> >took
> > > straight from an example.
> > >
> > > 4. Stay calm. If you come across an issue and you know it will not
> >affect
> > > further configuration, skip it and come back.
> > >
> > > 5. My personal touch. I kept track of each section and the points. I
> >marked
> > > the ones I truly believed I got correct. As soon as I hit 80%, the
> >rest
> >was
> > > buffer in case for some reason I missed a question I thought I
> >answered
> > > correctly.
> > >
> > > I know these are no real words of wisdom. I am a little in disbelief
> >at
> >the
> > > moment. This was my first attempt. All I really have to say is WOW!
> > >
> > > Thank you all again.
> > >
> > >
> > > Tony Schaffran
> > > Network Analyst
> > > CCIE #11071
> > > CCNP, CCNA, CCDA,
> > > NNCSS, NNCDS, CNE, MCSE
> > >
> > > www.cconlinelabs.com
> > > "Your #1 choice for Cisco rack rentals."
> > > .
> >.
> >.
> >.
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