From: rich (rich@pixguru.com)
Date: Wed Sep 18 2002 - 22:46:36 GMT-3
generaliZation
----- Original Message -----
From: "Olive, Darren" <Darren.Olive@globalcrossing.com>
To: "'Tom Larus'" <tlarus@cox.net>; <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
Sent: Wednesday, September 18, 2002 7:26 AM
Subject: RE: MS-CCIE
> I would say that it is best to have the experience & the certification.
The
> certification ensures that best practices are adhered to, as someone who
has
> his experience alone may not appreciate the 'correct' way of doing things.
> On the other hand, the "lab rat" comment strikes me as being made by an
> individual who has a problem with people with a higher intellect and is a
> sweeping generalisation that those with certs only ever read books and
never
> actually put what they learn into practice.
>
> I would hazard a guess that most of the individuals on this list are
> seasoned professionals who are using the CCIE as a way of measuring their
> own ability and focusing their studies.
>
> Just my 2 cents!
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Tom Larus [mailto:tlarus@cox.net]
> Sent: 18 September 2002 14:55
> To: ccielab@groupstudy.com
> Subject: MS-CCIE
>
>
> If the CCIE is not worth much these days, and you are in it primarily for
> the
> money, and you already have a good job, and respect, and know so much more
> than those "lab rat" CCIEs, just stop pursuing the CCIE.
>
> You don't need it.
>
> You should stand pat on your experience and be comfortable in knowing that
> years of experience will always trump demonstrated intelligence.
>
> Tom Larus, CCIE #10,014
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "rich" <rich@pixguru.com>
> To: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 17, 2002 9:04 PM
> Subject: MS-CCIE
>
>
> > A couple of years ago, at the height of the dot com era, a CCIE in my
area
> > could easily pull in 150k. Did I start down this road for the money?
> Hell
> > yes. I already had field experience, a good job, seniority, respect,
and
> all
> > that stuff that makes work fun. Besides, CCIE would be a challenge.
But
> a
> > LOT has changed in the past couple of years. Bad economy. Fewer jobs.
> > Lowered salaries. And apparently a butt load of CCIE's! I mean wow!
And
> to
> > hear that many of them are just lab ccie's really brings the 8000+
CCIE's
> into
> > a different light. It brings my own efforts into the same light. It
> reminds
> > me of what happened to Novell certifications... I had just gotten my CNE
> when
> > I heard the term 'paper CNE' about a guy at the same company who carried
> cue
> > cards around to customers with commands written on them.
> >
> > I haven't gotten my ccie yet but I'm hoping to. My chances would
probably
> be
> > greatly enhanced by going to a boot-camp, but I feel that would just add
> to
> > the problem. Maybe limiting the number of active CCIE's in a country
> would
> > keep the certification from getting too bloated. Or maybe just stop the
> > certification process now or at a fixed number. Or better yet, allow no
> more
> > than 1000 a year (total) to be certified. Candidate selection process
> could
> > be a weighted drawing (increased chances every year).
> >
> > I'm not trying to criticize anyone's efforts, but rather express the
> results
> > of those efforts. It's kind of liking moving into a new, quiet,
expensive
> > neighborhood. It's great until everyone else moves in, and suddenly
that
> > expensive house isn't worth what you paid for it.
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