Re: OT - V4, week 1, no new CCIEs?

Or put a camera on each student and log the keystrokes. Did the person
verify or did they just write erase, reload, and type in the correct
answers.

I like the human network and the tether around the throat approach.

On Fri, Oct 30, 2009 at 3:30 PM, <Charles.Henson_at_regions.com> wrote:
> That's funny, I was thinking the complete opposite. I like the idea, don't
> get me wrong. But, if you want to protect the integrity of the lab, don't
> make it cheaper and more readily available. Do the opposite. Constrain the
> number of testing centers. Knock it back to a "core 4" if necessary. Park
> the mobile lab. Heck, I'm a camper. I'll gut the RV and renovate it for the
> kids. Then have each lab done with a proctor tethered to you. Seriously.
> For $1400 each candidate has an 8 hour lab with a proctor at his side
> grilling him the whole way. Critiquing the setup. Asking questions to the
> candidate. That will weed out the cheats. Less automation and more human
> interaction. That is how you protect the certification.
>
> Charles Henson
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> From: Atlanta CCIE <atlantaccie_at_gmail.com>
>
> To: "Routt, Rob" <Rob.Routt_at_itron.com>, Charles.Henson_at_regions.com, Radioactive Frog
> <pbhatkoti_at_gmail.com>, Brad Ellis <brad_at_ccbootcamp.com>, Cisco certification
> <ccielab_at_groupstudy.com>, nobody_at_groupstudy.com, omar parihuana <omar.parihuana_at_gmail.com>, Roy
> Waterman <roy.waterman_at_gmail.com>, Smooth IE <smoothccie_at_googlemail.com>
>
> Date: 10/30/2009 01:29 PM
>
> Subject: Re: OT - V4, week 1, no new CCIEs?
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Great ideas guy!
>
> On 10/30/09, Routt, Rob <Rob.Routt_at_itron.com> wrote:
>> I tell you what, written every 3 and lab-sim every 5, lower the cost to
>> $300, and let me take it at VUE for say a 5 hour hands-on. That would
>> definitely sell a lot of workbooks and keep the IE population on its
>> toes and current; thereby topping any cert in the world in
>> value(definitively). The thing that has to happen is that Cisco, VUE, or
>> whomever would have to verify the integrity of the labs or set-up 1,000
>> or so scenarios/labs. Who could memorize all of those if compromised?
>> Then, it changes more frequently too, no need to wait 3 years to add
>> MPLS or take away old technologies. That would take a lot of commitment
>> from Cisco I think, but it would also almost guarantee the integrity of
>> the exam. Difficult, PIA, not reasonable, agreed.
>>
>> I should get back to studying...
>>
>> -R
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nobody_at_groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody_at_groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
>> Atlanta CCIE
>> Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 6:53 AM
>> To: Charles.Henson_at_regions.com; Radioactive Frog; Brad Ellis; Cisco
>> certification; nobody_at_groupstudy.com; omar parihuana; Roy Waterman;
>> Smooth IE
>> Subject: Re: OT - V4, week 1, no new CCIEs?
>>
>> Take out the luck factor aka OEQs and we have 6 hours for config part.
>> I just HOPE they keep changing the stuff otherwise we will be in the
>> same situation.
>>
>> Also - let's remove the thing about recert with written. Every three
>> years you MUST pass ANY ccie track's lab to recert. Now THAT will be
>> something :)
>>
>> On 10/30/09, Charles.Henson_at_regions.com <Charles.Henson_at_regions.com>
>> wrote:
>>> Yeah I saw that. I was thinking about going back at the end of the
>>> year but I think I might need to re-focus on a few things.
>>> ALL-FROM-NJs thread definitely was a good write-up and has me
>> thinking....
>>>
>>> Charles Henson
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> From: Radioactive Frog <pbhatkoti_at_gmail.com>
>>>
>>>
>>> To: Atlanta CCIE <atlantaccie_at_gmail.com>
>>>
>>>
>>> Cc: omar parihuana <omar.parihuana_at_gmail.com>, Roy Waterman
>>> <roy.waterman_at_gmail.com>, Brad Ellis
>>> <brad_at_ccbootcamp.com>, Smooth IE
>>> <smoothccie_at_googlemail.com>, Cisco certification
>>> <ccielab_at_groupstudy.com>
>>>
>>>
>>> Date: 10/30/2009 07:05 AM
>>>
>>>
>>> Subject: Re: OT - V4, week 1, no new CCIEs?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> looks like when lab changes it has a good effect :)
>>>
>>> 32 days and only 6 voice ccie ?
>>>
>>> *CCIE Count Change by Country*
>>> [image: CCIE Count Change by
>>> Country]<
>>> http://www.cisco.com/web/learning/le3/ccie/certified_ccies/worldwide.h
>>> tml>
>>> Source: Dual CCIE #18532 George Morton
>>> <http://www.madisonsolutions.net/>
>>>
>>> Growth of the China CCIE count goes negative by -9
>>> http://www.networkworld.com/community/node/46893
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 10:38 AM, Atlanta CCIE
>>> <atlantaccie_at_gmail.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> I hear you. My point was that you only had to CONFIGURE 59 points
>>>> worth
>>> of
>>>> tasks to pass ASSUMING you got 21 on the OEQs. Before folks had to
>>>> CONFIGURE 80 points worth of tasks :) Thats all.
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 7:01 PM, omar parihuana
>>>> <omar.parihuana_at_gmail.com
>>>> >wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > hahaha... sorry guy but many people din't pass between Feb and
>> Oct...
>>>> and
>>>> > after OEQ introduction IMHO the lab exam wasn't ever a fair game...
>>
>>>> > if
>>>> you
>>>> > got 100% in lab sectio and fail at least 2/4 in OEQ you failed.. so
>>
>>>> > why
>>>> the
>>>> > "easiest of rides"?... if you weren't able to answer 3/4 OEQ game
>>>> > over!! have you asked somebody who took the exam before Feb and
>>>> > retook between Feb-Oct if the lab exam was more difficult before
>>>> > Feb,
>>> and
>>>> > easy after Feb?
>>>> >
>>>> > RGds.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 5:37 PM, Atlanta CCIE
>>>> ><atlantaccie_at_gmail.com
>>>> >wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> So it appears that anyone who passed during Feb 2009 - Oct 18th
>>>> >> 2009
>>> had
>>>> >> the
>>>> >> easiest of rides............. 21 Points and get 59 points on the
>>>> >> lab
>>> and
>>>> >> you
>>>> >> are set. I have heard stories where folks were done by 12pm :D
>>>> >>
>>>> >> On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 6:12 PM, Roy Waterman
>>>> >> <roy.waterman_at_gmail.com
>>>> >> >wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> > Hi Brad
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Based on this fact, if the situation were to continue with some
>>>> >> > more
>>>> >> weeks
>>>> >> > passing with noone or a couple of ppl passing, would Cisco be
>>> looking
>>>> to
>>>> >> > make appropriate changes so that people who do know their stuff
>>>> >> > are
>>>> able
>>>> >> to
>>>> >> > have a decent chance of passing?
>>>> >> > From reports, it does appear to me that running out of time is a
>>> much
>>>> >> > bigger
>>>> >> > problem than it was in v3.
>>>> >> > It appears that:
>>>> >> > - there isnt time to go back over your work to verify
>>>> >> > - there isnt time to diagram or read the lab
>>>> >> > - there isnt time to go back over questions you may have got
>>>> >> > stuck
>>> on
>>>> >> > earlier
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Just curious as to whether you know if Cisco are happy with
>>>> >> > things
>>> as
>>>> >> they
>>>> >> > are, and intend to keep them that way, & also whether they
>>>> >> > intend to
>>>> act
>>>> >> > upon what certain ppl who took the beta lab had to say (one of
>>>> >> > which
>>>> was
>>>> >> > time ;))
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > 2009/10/27 Brad Ellis <brad_at_ccbootcamp.com>
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > > It's confirmed: as of yesterday, no one has passed the new
>>>> >> > > CCIE
>>> R&S
>>>> >> lab
>>>> >> > > exam. Some people have passed certain parts, but no one has
>>>> >> > > passed
>>>> all
>>>> >> > > three parts - at least yet!
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > > thanks,
>>>> >> > > Brad Ellis
>>>> >> > > CCIE#5796 (R&S / Security)
>>>> >> > > CCSI# 30482
>>>> >> > > CEO / President
>>>> >> > > CCBOOTCAMP - Cisco Learning Solutions Partner (CLSP)
>>>> >> > > Email: brad_at_ccbootcamp.com
>>>> >> > > Toll Free: 877-654-2243
>>>> >> > > International: +1-702-968-5100
>>>> >> > > Skype: skype:ccbootcamp?call
>>>> >> > > FAX: +1-702-446-8012
>>>> >> > > YES! We take Cisco Learning Credits!
>>>> >> > > Training And Remote Racks: http://www.ccbootcamp.com
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > > -----Original Message-----
>>>> >> > > From: nobody_at_groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody_at_groupstudy.com] On
>>>> Behalf
>>>> >> Of
>>>> >> > > Smooth IE
>>>> >> > > Sent: Monday, October 26, 2009 2:19 PM
>>>> >> > > To: Cisco certification
>>>> >> > > Subject: Re: OT - V4, week 1, no new CCIEs?
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > > my friend claims to have passed last week. not sure of any
>>>> >> > > more
>>>> >> details
>>>> >> > > other than taht yet.
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > > 2009/10/26 Brad Ellis <brad_at_ccbootcamp.com>
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > > > Im at building C in SJ right now. Based on the # of people
>>> waiting
>>>> >> (or
>>>> >> > > > lack there of) for the proctor this morning, I'd venture to
>>>> >> > > > say
>>>> >> > > there's
>>>> >> > > > a LOT of capacity for the R&S exam right now. I usually see
>>>> >> > > > 10+
>>>> >> people
>>>> >> > > > waiting in the Building C lobby at 8.10am. Today, there were
>>> only
>>>> >> four
>>>> >> > > > total!
>>>> >> > > >
>>>> >> > > > thanks,
>>>> >> > > > Brad Ellis
>>>> >> > > > CCIE#5796 (R&S / Security)
>>>> >> > > > CCSI# 30482
>>>> >> > > > CEO / President
>>>> >> > > > CCBOOTCAMP - Cisco Learning Solutions Partner (CLSP)
>>>> >> > > > Email: brad_at_ccbootcamp.com
>>>> >> > > > Toll Free: 877-654-2243
>>>> >> > > > International: +1-702-968-5100
>>>> >> > > > Skype: skype:ccbootcamp?call
>>>> >> > > > FAX: +1-702-446-8012
>>>> >> > > > YES! We take Cisco Learning Credits!
>>>> >> > > > Training And Remote Racks: http://www.ccbootcamp.com
>>>> >> > > >
>>>> >> > > >
>>>> >> > > > -----Original Message-----
>>>> >> > > > From: nobody_at_groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody_at_groupstudy.com]
>>>> >> > > > On
>>>> >> Behalf
>>>> >> > > Of
>>>> >> > > > Jonny English
>>>> >> > > > Sent: Monday, October 26, 2009 11:05 AM
>>>> >> > > > To: Rick Mur
>>>> >> > > > Cc: Vibeesh S; Atlanta CCIE; Hammer; Cisco certification
>>>> >> > > > Subject: Re: OT - V4, week 1, no new CCIEs?
>>>> >> > > >
>>>> >> > > > last week someone said testing centers were full.....
>>>> >> > > >
>>>> >> > > > On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 2:17 AM, Rick Mur
>>>> >> > > > <rmur_at_ipexpert.com>
>>>> >> wrote:
>>>> >> > > >
>>>> >> > > > > I also think that the test centers were really empty the
>>>> >> > > > > last
>>>> >> week.
>>>> >> > > I
>>>> >> > > > think
>>>> >> > > > > people are quite scared of the new lab format and wait on
>>>> >> > > > > the
>>>> >> first
>>>> >> > > > > responses :-)
>>>> >> > > > >
>>>> >> > > > >
>>>> >> > > > > --
>>>> >> > > > >
>>>> >> > > > > Regards,
>>>> >> > > > >
>>>> >> > > > > Rick Mur
>>>> >> > > > > CCIE2 #21946 (R&S / Service Provider)
>>>> >> > > > > Sr. Support Engineer IPexpert, Inc.
>>>> >> > > > > URL: http://www.IPexpert.com <http://www.ipexpert.com/>
>>>> >> > > > >
>>>> >> > > > >
>>>> >> > > > > On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 2:10 PM, Vibeesh S
>>> <vibselva_at_gmail.com>
>>>> >> > > wrote:
>>>> >> > > > >
>>>> >> > > > >> I don't think many would have taken the lab in the first
>>>> >> > > > >> week
>>>> >> after
>>>> >> > > > >> change.
>>>> >> > > > >>
>>>> >> > > > >> On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 6:21 PM, Atlanta CCIE
>>>> >> > > <atlantaccie_at_gmail.com>
>>>> >> > > > >> wrote:
>>>> >> > > > >>
>>>> >> > > > >> > Sucks for the people of the 3rd world countries. Oh
>>>> >> > > > >> > wait
>>>> until
>>>> >> > > > things
>>>> >> > > > >> > start leaking out of china and india and may be dubai
>>>> >> > > > >> > :)
>>>> >> > > > >> >
>>>> >> > > > >> > On 10/26/09, Jonny English <redkidneybeans_at_gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>> >> > > > >> > > not everyone posts on GS. So who knows, someone might
>>> have
>>>> >> > > > passed.
>>>> >> > > > >> > >
>>>> >> > > > >> > > On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 3:27 PM, Hammer
>>> <bhmccie_at_gmail.com
>>>> >
>>>> >> > > > wrote:
>>>> >> > > > >> > >
>>>> >> > > > >> > >> OK, It's been a week. Did ANYONE pass the lab or
>>>> >> > > > >> > >> hear of
>>>> >> > > anyone
>>>> >> > > > >> passing
>>>> >> > > > >> > >> the
>>>> >> > > > >> > >> first week? NO, I did not expect it. I was just
>> curious.
>>>> >> We've
>>>> >> > > > >> certainly
>>>> >> > > > >> > >> seen the comments from those that visited the labs
>>>> >> > > > >> > >> this
>>>> >> week.
>>>> >> > > > Nothing
>>>> >> > > > >> in
>>>> >> > > > >> > >> their comments made me feel good but we all know
>>>> >> > > > >> > >> that
>>>> Cisco
>>>> >> > > > needs
>>>> >> > > > >> some
>>>> >> > > > >> > >> time
>>>> >> > > > >> > >> to burn in the new setup.
>>>> >> > > > >> > >>
>>>> >> > > > >> > >> Back to BGP.....
>>>> >> > > > >> > >>
>>>> >> > > > >> > >> -Hammer
>>>> >> > > > >> > >>
>>>> >> > > > >> > >>
>>>> >> > > > >> > >> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>>> >> > > > >> > >>
>>>> >> > > > >> > >>
>>>> >> > > > >>
>>>> >> > > >
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >>
>>> ______________________________________________________________________
>>> _
>>>> >> > > > >> > >> Subscription information may be found at:
>>>> >> > > > >> > >> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>>>> >> > > > >> > >
>>>> >> > > > >> > >
>>>> >> > > > >> > > Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>>> >> > > > >> > >
>>>> >> > > > >> > >
>>>> >> > > > >>
>>>> >> > > >
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >>
>>> ______________________________________________________________________
>>> _
>>>> >> > > > >> > > Subscription information may be found at:
>>>> >> > > > >> > > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>>>> >> > > >
>>>> >> > > >
>>>> >> > > > Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>>> >> > > >
>>>> >> > > >
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >>
>>> ______________________________________________________________________
>>> _
>>>> >> > > > Subscription information may be found at:
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>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > > Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >>
>>> ______________________________________________________________________
>>> _
>>>> >> > > Subscription information may be found at:
>>>> >> > > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > > Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >>
>>> ______________________________________________________________________
>>> _
>>>> >> > > Subscription information may be found at:
>>>> >> > > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > --
>>>> >> > Regards
>>>> >> > Roy
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> _____________________________________________________________________
>>>> __
>>>> >> > Subscription information may be found at:
>>>> >> > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> --
>>>> >> CCIE# 17xxx
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>> ______________________________________________________________________
>>> _
>>>> >> Subscription information may be found at:
>>>> >> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > --
>>>> > Omar E.P.T
>>>> > -----------------
>>>> > Certified Networking Professionals make better Connections!
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> CCIE# 17xxx
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>>>
>>>> _____________________________________________________________________
>>>> __ Subscription information may be found at:
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>>>
>>>
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>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> Sent from my mobile device
>>
>> CCIE# 17xxx
>>
>>
>> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>
>> _______________________________________________________________________
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>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> --
> Sent from my mobile device
>
> CCIE# 17xxx
>
>
> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>
> _______________________________________________________________________
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>
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Received on Fri Oct 30 2009 - 15:36:15 ART