RE: OEQ NDA Question?

OH,

I thought it was time to discuss a real challenge instead of the QEQ's. In the time what about 5,000 people have become CCIE's with the QEQ's on the exam, about
15 people have become MCA's.

Love or hate Microsoft- at least they provide a real challenge for those up to it.

-Joe

-----Original Message-----
From: Tim [mailto:timcurci_at_roadrunner.com]
Sent: Saturday, September 05, 2009 8:08 PM
To: 'John Pelletier'; rwest_at_zyedge.com; dennis.worth_at_gmail.com; ccielab_at_groupstudy.com; 'Manoj (DS-1)Nanda'; Joseph L. Brunner
Subject: RE: OEQ NDA Question?

Why are we talking about Microsoft?

Did I miss the thread that invited that discussion?

-----Original Message-----
From: nobody_at_groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody_at_groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of John
Pelletier
Sent: Saturday, September 05, 2009 7:27 PM
To: timcurci_at_roadrunner.com; rwest_at_zyedge.com; dennis.worth_at_gmail.com;
ccielab_at_groupstudy.com; Manoj (DS-1)Nanda; Joseph L. Brunner
Subject: RE: OEQ NDA Question?

Well everyone has an opinion I would say this-the exchange cert below while
it
is exhaustive is a one trick pony which would be the equivalent of a
switching
only guru vs the CCIE lab that covers many technologies. On the OEQ the
questions cover the same breadth of topics while the exchange questions are
exactly that exchange questions.

--- On Sat, 9/5/09, Joseph L. Brunner <joe_at_affirmedsystems.com> wrote:

From: Joseph L. Brunner <joe_at_affirmedsystems.com>
Subject: RE: OEQ NDA Question?
To: "John Pelletier" <john.pelletier_at_altima-group.com>,
"timcurci_at_roadrunner.com" <timcurci_at_roadrunner.com>, "rwest_at_zyedge.com"
<rwest_at_zyedge.com>, "dennis.worth_at_gmail.com" <dennis.worth_at_gmail.com>,
"ccielab_at_groupstudy.com" <ccielab_at_groupstudy.com>, " Manoj (DS-1)Nanda"
<MNanda_at_drs-tsi.com>
Date: Saturday, September 5, 2009, 6:44 PM

Actually,

How do you think the MSFT MCA board review is compared to these QEQ's?

You have to speak and invoke passion and explain a complex solution, only to
be challenged on exact details of your proposed solution from a group of
industry veterans... all just to QUALIFY for a grueling 2 to 18 month
process
to achieve certification (if you ever achieve it). Some of the best Exchange
guys in the world who write widely used books and several 100 page blogs are
only Exchange Apprentices- and didn't not get their Exchange Ranger (MCA)
certifications...

I think Cisco is still quite a bit easier...

-Joe

-----Original Message-----
From: nobody_at_groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody_at_groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of John
Pelletier
Sent: Saturday, September 05, 2009 6:36 PM
To: timcurci_at_roadrunner.com; rwest_at_zyedge.com; dennis.worth_at_gmail.com;
ccielab_at_groupstudy.com; Manoj (DS-1)Nanda
Subject: Re: OEQ NDA Question?

In theory they do-it is called the written. The OEQ thing is over the top,
if
they want to do this then get rid of the written at least. AND then add MPLS
and VPN to a R&S exam while having a SP and Security tracks stinks of a MS
style money grab. Oh and add to that get it done in 8 hrs.

--- On Sat, 9/5/09, Nanda, Manoj (DS-1) <MNanda_at_drs-tsi.com> wrote:

From: Nanda, Manoj (DS-1) <MNanda_at_drs-tsi.com>
Subject: Re: OEQ NDA Question?
To: timcurci_at_roadrunner.com, rwest_at_zyedge.com, dennis.worth_at_gmail.com,
ccielab_at_groupstudy.com
Date: Saturday, September 5, 2009, 5:06 PM

It would be great if they had a separtate comprehensive OEQ prometric test
rather than combining it with the lab to cause people have this freaking
expansive travel and lunch tough to digest paying from your hard earned
money!!

----- Original Message -----
From: nobody_at_groupstudy.com <nobody_at_groupstudy.com>
To: 'Ryan West' <rwest_at_zyedge.com>; 'Dennis Worth' <dennis.worth_at_gmail.com>;
ccielab_at_groupstudy.com <ccielab_at_groupstudy.com>
Sent: Sat Sep 05 16:17:31 2009
Subject: RE: OEQ NDA Question?

It is just amazing that "people" did not see this coming a few months ago.
As I stated in May, the QEQs are not a statistically valid method of
testing. Many in this forum who already have multiple CCIEs (3 or 4)
disagreed... This is kind of funny. Cisco will be able to play games by
asking 4-5 subjective questions that they feel should be easily answered by
a qualified CCIE candidate (whatever that means). If Cisco is going to
continue with the QEQs, they should eliminate the $350 pre-qualification
exam for each track if they feel the pre-qualification exams have been
compromised or they should do more to secure the lab exam itself. Maybe the
pre-qualification exam should be a written (pencil and paper) proctored
exam.

-----Original Message-----
From: nobody_at_groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody_at_groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of Ryan
West
Sent: Saturday, September 05, 2009 3:57 PM
To: Dennis Worth; <ccielab_at_groupstudy.com> <ccielab_at_groupstudy.com>
Subject: RE: OEQ NDA Question?

I've heard and wondered the same thing. Unfortunately, no one at Cisco is
likely to speak up and give us that answer. Part of the reason I have said
to never underestimate the OEQ's is that 4 months after the exam, I just
stumbled upon the answer to one of my OEQs. I had two questions that were
like this.

I have a little theory on this though. I believe students at all the
testing centers that are within reasonable timezones of one another have the
same set of OEQs. If only a couple of the students answer the question
correctly, it's counted as valid. If no one answers it correctly, then
those who are very close get credit. Something similar to blowing the curve
or discarding the outliers.

When I was speaking with the proctors at lunch, they both knew one of the
questions I was referring to and I could tell they thought it was bogus and
basically responded with "well, there are 3 others.." I know I was 2/3rd of
the way correct on one question and sort of almost practically somewhat
(scientific terms) correct on the other. I would not have expected most
CCIE candidates to get those two questions correct, one was better suited
for another track.

I would love to share my two, maybe one day when I get permission.

-ryan

-----Original Message-----
From: nobody_at_groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody_at_groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
Dennis Worth
Sent: Saturday, September 05, 2009 1:57 PM
To: <ccielab_at_groupstudy.com> <ccielab_at_groupstudy.com>
Subject: OEQ NDA Question?

Group,
I was thinking that if the questions that Cisco asked in OEQ's are not used
twice. Can't we share that information or least get clarity from other
engineers on how they would answer, so that we can learn to provide the
right solution next time?

Any thought's on this?

--
Dennis Worth
Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net