Re: Petition: Revamp or Replace OEQ

Did I miss something in there? I believe (earlier on in this growing
thread) I said there was room for improvement, just didn't agree with
the track Darby was proposing.

Everything gold? Good lord, no. But there is merit in the concept as I
had noted. Concept versus delivery are two different things.

So, read... Read all. Things will make more sense then.

Scott

Rick Tyrell wrote:
> Brad, Scott,
>
> It seems that you don't think Cisco can make mistakes? Everything
> that comes out of Cisco's mouth is Gold? You guys are unbelievable.
>
> William drop the attitude man....and just because you work on
> "pre-deployment functional testing on code" doesn't make us any closer
> friends.
>
> Cisco is there to make money, that's the bottom line.
>
> Good luck with CCIE studies all.
>
> On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 12:43 PM, Darby Weaver <darby.weaver_at_gmail.com
> <mailto:darby.weaver_at_gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> Now see this is viable solution to the problem.
>
> 1. Registered Lab Attendees have the same limitations as lab
> candidates.
>
> 2. Pre-Lab 3-6 months before a lab date (6 months seems more
> practical).
>
> 3. Adminstration Cost - Say $125-200 for the 30 minute test.
>
> 4. No repeat questions.
>
> 5. No reference materials.
>
> 6. Maybe scratch #1 and if you fail the OEQ Mini-Test - Take is a
> warning to
> go back and study for 4-6 months.
>
> Other ideas?
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 1:35 PM, Scott Morris <smorris_at_ine.com
> <mailto:smorris_at_ine.com>> wrote:
>
> > Statistics. The object isn't to test your knowledge of the entire
> > blueprint, just a subset thereof.
> >
> > If it were done the way >I< would design it, you'd get some initial
> > questions, and if you failed them, you wouldn't even be able to
> see the rest
> > of the lab. THAT would solve the braindump problem. But
> wouldn't that piss
> > you off even more, to go, and 30 minutes later you're kicked out?
> >
> > On the bright side, you get the see the entire lab, and you'll
> get to see
> > exactly what/how things are being asked. The next time you'll pass.
> >
> > People have this problem with written tests all the time. The
> thing that
> > makes this format harder is that it isn't "multiple guess".
> That, and when
> > people fail a $125 test, they're irritated, but not quite as much!
> >
> > Scott
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Nadeem Rafi wrote:
> >
> > why only 4 questions.... its quite unfair. questions should be
> gone as for
> > dumpers troubleshooting can do the trick. If these are not gone
> then at
> > least should be increased so that a question should not cost
> 1400 USD which
> > in many countries is more than few months salary.
> > just few thoughts....
> >
> >
> > On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 8:11 PM, Scott Morris <smorris_at_ine.com
> <mailto:smorris_at_ine.com>> <smorris_at_ine.com
> <mailto:smorris_at_ine.com>> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > Let's not be too far off the beaten path here...
> >
> > First of all, missing one question is just fine. Missing two
> will cause
> > you to have an expensive lunch. So keep with the accurate
> program here
> > (Maurilio had these details long ago).
> >
> > Now, I may be part of the minority (and arguable since I don't
> have to
> > take them), but I am in favor of the OEQs. I think the idea is very
> > much worthwhile.
> >
> > Now, I sit back and hear a lot about the quality of the
> questions from
> > people, and see the folks who SHOULD be passing yet are not, which
> > indicates a problem. But it's one that's simple to fix as part
> of a QA
> > process from Cisco. (That's not Question/Answer by the way)
> >
> > If you have QUALITY questions, they can achieve the goal needed,
> and can
> > easily be argued that those who miss them do so based on
> techincal merit
> > rather than some other absurd reason.
> >
> > Boycotting's an interesting idea, but unless you have some plan
> to reach
> > EVERYONE out there and make a serious impact the quantity of
> people from
> > GS going will merely make it look like a statistical blip.
> >
> > But if everyone who feels wronged by the OEQs files a certification
> > support ticket, it will force the group to review the questions,
> and any
> > anomolies or "bad questions" will be more easily recognized by
> the "in
> > your face"escalation process.
> >
> > Just my two cents. (As opposed to $1,400)
> >
> > Scott
> >
> >
> > Darby Weaver wrote:
> >
> >
> > Well we could just say that...
> >
> > However, Cisco is a Marketing Company and is a For-Profit
> Company and the
> > CCIE Program has become a profit-making venture.
> >
> > I think the term Boycott is a bit stronger and has a little more
> effect.
> >
> > When the number of CCIE's available for Cisco Partners starts to
> turn
> > NEGATIVE...
> >
> > Cisco has a choice, either Get Rid of the OEQ...
> >
> > OR...
> >
> > REVAMP the Cisco Partner Program...
> >
> > Maybe there is a 3rd Option... or 4th...
> >
> > But if there are no CCIE's... the CCDE is likely to take a tumble...
> >
> > No CCDE's what happens to the CCA?
> >
> >
> > It's got quite the Domino-Effect...
> >
> > Let's see how many people active on this list care to voice
> their own
> > opinions...
> >
> > Taking the CCIE Lab and Failing based on "One Question"... is
> ludicrous
> >
> >
> > at
> >
> >
> > best.
> >
> >
> > There are 4 questions. 3 will earn a candidate 21 points...
> >
> > Lose 1 question more and you lose $1400.00 + Travel and Expenses.
> >
> > More in some countries as I understand it.
> >
> >
> > $2000-2500.00 for 1 question?
> >
> > Excuse me but this is ABSURD!
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 12:49 PM, Mark Matters
> <markccie_at_gmail.com <mailto:markccie_at_gmail.com>>
> <markccie_at_gmail.com <mailto:markccie_at_gmail.com>>
> >
> > wrote:
> >
> >
> > Your email looks like it's missing a few words, confusing.
> > But I agree. GET RID OF THE OEQ
> >
> > On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 12:35 PM, Darby Weaver
> <darby.weaver_at_gmail.com <mailto:darby.weaver_at_gmail.com>
> >
> > wrote:
> >
> >
> > Seems like we need a petition to make the point clear.
> >
> > Now if some of you guys don't think that some of the OEQ's are
> fair...
> >
> >
> > I
> >
> >
> > have to ask the question is repeating "Hearsay" even close the
> breaking
> > the
> > NDA?
> >
> > Because if I were to show you some questions that I've run
> across you
> > might now find them so easy and if the instructors themselves can't
> >
> >
> > find
> >
> >
> > reasonable answers... in a reasonable time-frame... (Ummm....
> >
> >
> > Candidates
> >
> >
> > only get 30 minutes for 4 of these puppies and no use of Google.com
> >
> >
> > btw).
> >
> >
> > I've got to ask you? Who are we trying to get to pass the CCIE
> Lab?
> >
> > Disclaimer: See the first batch of OEQ. Straight forward mostly.
> >
> > If your questions start asking "Why"...
> >
> > You might as well just hand in your lab guide and catch your
> plane and
> >
> >
> > go
> >
> >
> > home... Unless you know you nailed them and did not second guess
> > yourself.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Darby Weaver
> > Network Engineer
> >
> > 407-802-7394darbyweaver_at_yahoo.com
> <mailto:407-802-7394darbyweaver_at_yahoo.com>
> >
> >
> > Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
> <http://www.ccie.net/>
> >
> >
> _______________________________________________________________________
> > Subscription information may be found
> at:http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> >
> > -
> > "The more I learn the less I know". This is incredibly
> frustrating to
> >
> >
> > me.
> >
> >
> > Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
> <http://www.ccie.net/>
> >
> >
> _______________________________________________________________________
> > Subscription information may be found
> at:http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
> >
> > Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
> <http://www.ccie.net/>
> >
> >
> _______________________________________________________________________
> > Subscription information may be found at:
> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Darby Weaver
> Network Engineer
>
> 407-802-7394
> darbyweaver_at_yahoo.com <mailto:darbyweaver_at_yahoo.com>
>
>
> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net <http://www.ccie.net/>
>
> _______________________________________________________________________
> Subscription information may be found at:
> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html

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Received on Sat Sep 05 2009 - 18:57:51 ART