From: Scott Morris (swm@emanon.com)
Date: Thu Jul 03 2008 - 09:09:38 ART
Should I point out that in order to make 3MM in revenue at $102 an hour they
would have to bill for 29,412 hours? Considering we have a 2,000 hour work
year, and technically only 8,736 hours exist in a year that's pretty damned
impressive!
I'm guessing he has multiple people working for him, or he's not entirely
accurate on the numbering scheme there.
Not to deflate anything there, but there's likely more to that story! ;)
Anyway, no matter how certified and experienced you are, there's always
market rate. No matter how much I would like to, I can't charge 4 x normal
rate because I have four CCIE's. It would be cool though, but business
people don't think in that fashion!
Scott
_____
From: Isabella Figarella [mailto:gigi.ccie@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, July 03, 2008 5:57 AM
To: swm@emanon.com
Cc: Joseph Brunner; Luan Nguyen; ccielab@groupstudy.com
Subject: Re: Salary Question Again!
Good info Scott. I just met someone who only charges $102.00 per hour.
Does not charge for gas/travel for his very local clients and he earned over
$650,000.00 last year of about $3,000,000 in revenue. Now that's nice. 4
years ago he earned about $40,000.00 per year as an employee. He quit the
company and 10 months later bought it. Not even a CCNA on him. Now that is
impressive! One must find the balance. This guy did and he just bought a
$200,000.00 or so house in another country and that is how I met him while
he was in town.
So a being a CCIE is great. A CCIE with business acumen and a firm
understanding of customer service can do quite well even in this economy. I
read Joseph's comments about $150.00 per hour as a CCIE in New York and
Darby's comments about $165.00 per hour without a CCIE in Florida and yet
another CCIE's comments about $175.00 per hour in D.C. for a double CCIE
with a master's degree and a security clearance. The rates are not that
much different for all three of these people and yet their certification and
education level may be. I guess it depends on negotiations and Scott has hit
the mark with a bullseye.
On Thu, Jul 3, 2008 at 1:01 AM, Scott Morris <swm@emanon.com> wrote:
I try not to kiss and tell, so no point getting into details.
Everyone has their own tax implications, their own needs and desires, and
their own best ways to accomplish all of the above.
Even as a W2, think outside the box. If you want your life structured in a
particular fashion (amount of $$, # of hours, whatever) then negotiate it.
Keep in mind it's likely not going to be something perfect. Utopia doesn't
exist (look at the greek roots). But that's also why they call it
negotiation! Each side wants different things given a perfect world, and
you meet someplace in the middle where both sides can be reasonably happy
and accomplish what they want to.
Believe it or not, it's not all about money! While I'd absolutely love to
get a 7-figure salary to sit on a beach all day long, I'm not holding my
breath for that. Although, when recruiters ask the stupid question about
what your dream job is, that's what I tell them. It tells me whether they
have a sense of humor or not. :)
Two rules in life. Have fun. Make money. Not necessarily in that order,
but some mix of those two is what makes things worthwhile.
Secret sauce though, everyone has to come up with their own mix.
Cheers,
Scott Morris, CCIE4 #4713, JNCIE-M #153, JNCIS-ER, CISSP, et al.
CCSI/JNCI-M/JNCI-ER
Senior CCIE Instructor
smorris@internetworkexpert.com
Internetwork Expert, Inc.
http://www.InternetworkExpert.com <http://www.internetworkexpert.com/>
Toll Free: 877-224-8987 x 705
Outside US: 775-826-4344 x 705
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Knowledge is power.
Power corrupts.
Study hard and be Eeeeviiiil......
-----Original Message-----
From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
Joseph Brunner
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 11:26 PM
To: 'Isabella Figarella'
Cc: 'Luan Nguyen'; ccielab@groupstudy.com
Subject: RE: Salary Question Again!
I can't speak for Scott, as his Jedi skills are far greater than mine. so I
wont dare try.
I love internetworkexpert. The moment I laid eyes on their materials last
year when I bought IEWB Vol 2, I knew I would get through that material and
get my number. I bought the printed version, and while initially
challenging, to this day it continues to grow on me. I can see why Scott
would want to work there.
NRF has said many times that if you want money just go be an banker or
trader (although some of them are surely hurting now too).
What I meant by my original reply, is to be careful and not get ripped off.
if a CCNP makes $100,000 a year, and many suck ("hey, Joe, why is the
internet running slow?"), why shouldn't someone how knows many times as
much, make at least 2x as much?
Especially in the case when you are a business asset being billed out a high
dollar rate per hour. I have heard many stories of DC area CCIE's like Luan
be billed out for like $500 a hour- I mean it's the tax payers money right,
who the hell cares? I can believe the waste, the layers of crap that are
paid for by us taxpayers! how many juiced in govt. contractors are eating
steaks and driving escalades, and flying private jets on guys like LUAN's
back.
see?
_____
From: Isabella Figarella [mailto:gigi.ccie@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 8:55 PM
To: Joseph Brunner
Cc: Luan Nguyen; ccielab@groupstudy.com
Subject: Re: Salary Question Again!
Joseph,
Why do you suppose a guy like Scott Morris with 4 CCIE's is working for
someone else? Or others? I mean Narbik is a starchild and has proven that
someone can sell training for a lab at $2000.00 a head and make a decent
living.
On Wed, Jul 2, 2008 at 9:48 AM, Joseph Brunner <joe@affirmedsystems.com>
wrote:
$250,000, or $125 an hour corp to corp.
this is where you go to legalzoom.com <http://legalzoom.com/>
<http://legalzoom.com/> get an C or S
Corp, or an LLC and pay yourself a modest salary, pay your children, wife
modest salaries (ala bill cosby and Bryant gumble) and avoid taxes on the
gross amount. the gross amount is no longer income, its "revenue". Speak to
your CPA about this, its quite common.
Get what your worth man don't take a W2 salary to sit there and look smart
but get paid stupid.
-J
-----Original Message-----
From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of Luan
Nguyen
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 9:37 AM
To: ccielab@groupstudy.com
Subject: OT: Salary Question Again!
Hi guys,
In lieu of Mister Scott Morris left for IE, and with Jared's advise :)
yep...putting you guys on the spot :P. I am thinking of testing
opportunities out...putting my resume on linkedin..etc I am in the northern
virginia area. What do you think i should start negotiating at?
Have 10+ years of experience. Working my way from the ground up. Supported
university computer lab, Did computer carrier at the pentagon, did 12-8
night shift of computer operator...etc, worked at the IRS, the marriott
(these guys have funky networks) the last 8 years, working at an institution
of sort :) touching all things...lucent, nortel, nokia, ixia, spirent,
juniper, arbor,...etc. The last couple years started to refocus on cisco.
have ccie r&s and all sort of ccxp (np, dp, sp, vp) written ie security, sp,
written ccde :) though...i got the ccnp and ccdp back in 1999 so maybe i
should put ex-ccnp :). Back then with passing, they gave u t-shirt :) for
CCNA too i think. With CCDP, they gave you a black leather porfolio...
Thanks in advance for all inputs.
-Luan
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