From: Paul Cosgrove (paul.cosgrove@heanet.ie)
Date: Mon Apr 14 2008 - 07:26:37 ART
I attended Nar-b1k's bootcamp along with D@-rby and the others. Didn't
even know Nar-b1k had been banned and I'm another who has no idea why he
would be. Sad to see that the inclusion of peoples names causes emails
to be filtered out. Seems the open policy isn't as open as I previously
thought.
Paul Cosgrove.
Scott Morris wrote:
> He keeps avoiding my bootcamp. I think it scares people. :)
>
> But that's beside the point. Nobody should be banned because of the fact
> they run a bootcamp. Otherwise, the Brians, Bruce, Bob, myself and others
> would have been gone a long while ago.
>
> I'm hoping there's simply something more to the story than all the rest of
> us happen to know about. Hell if I know what it is though!
>
>
> Scott Morris, CCIE4 (R&S/ISP-Dial/Security/Service Provider) #4713, JNCIE-M
> #153, JNCIS-ER, CISSP, et al.
> CCSI/JNCI-M/JNCI-ER
> VP - Technical Training - IPexpert, Inc.
> IPexpert Sr. Technical Instructor
>
> smorris@ipexpert.com
>
>
>
> Telephone: +1.810.326.1444
> Fax: +1.810.454.0130
> http://www.ipexpert.com
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
> Joseph Brunner
> Sent: Sunday, April 13, 2008 4:40 PM
> To: 'Joshua'; 'Ramy Sisy'; 'Cisco certification'
> Subject: RE: ********
>
> I'm not going to trash the bootcamps...
>
> But I will say this about them... the money is better spent on actual lab
> attempts...
>
> D@R6Y has been to ALL the bootcamps in the world (from what I can tell) and
> sorry D@R6Y, he STILL hasn't passed yet...
>
> In regards to Cert Science, you can't make a person into CCIE in 6 weeks.
> You can't guarantee someone is smart enough to pass the lab, or disciplined
> enough to come back to it if they fail the lab.
>
> I am a CCNP instructor. I make my own workbooks. Many people who have passed
> the written and are already CCNP's are unable to do them. Why? One guy said
> he was just going for the lab, and now is taking my CCNP class in 2 weeks.
>
> A person has to commit to being great. The type of person who will need a
> bootcamp to get them motivated to approach greatness, is not same type of
> person who has such a strong self-starter they can just stay at home, save
> the money and show the discipline to be great on their own.
>
> I started teaching to find excellent people for my Consulting firm. Then I
> realized, wait, I am what I am because I didn't go to bootcamps. I taught my
> self discipline while banging away at the CLI for thousands of hours and
> making notes the last 8 years. I have taught over 100+ people Cisco since
> 05/2007. Only 2 people (SO FAR) exhibit the patience and discipline to do
> what I do (show up and take control of a network, document it, fix it,
> explain what you are doing). So the Jury is still out on whether training is
> worth the time of the INSTRUCTOR.
>
> So let's forget about bootcamps on this board. Let's just talk about the
> technology.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
> Joshua
> Sent: Sunday, April 13, 2008 4:14 PM
> To: 'Ramy Sisy'; 'Cisco certification'
> Subject: ********
>
> Searching for a good CCIE boot camp is no different than searching for a
> good university or advanced degree program to which to attend. Many schools
> just simply have stronger programs and have a much better reputation than
> most others. Bottom line is that the student is just going to have to do
> their homework to figure out which to attend. Depending on the school of
> choice, the student may have to do more work at one school versus another.
> And like most schools, there are professors that very highly respected and
> maybe even become a trusted mentor for many students. Then, there are the
> "other" professors who just plain suck and you are left with questioning
> just how in the hell that person made it through the vetting process.
> Chances are, it is because of that one professor that will slow your
> progress. CCIE boot camp/schools and instructors are no different. Some
> are just damn awesome, while others will essentially drive a stake into the
> ground through your foot.
>
> $Nar--bik" was banned because former students were commenting about the high
> quality of his classes.
> But, from what I have seen on GS, certainly not any more than formers
> students who have attended competing boot camps. What made $Dar**by's
> situation different was that he posted daily reports while attending
> *Nar-B-iks class. He was giving a daily account of **Narb-ik's
> professionalism, abilities as an instructor, the quality of his classroom
> instruction, curriculum and what topics we covered. This was from a
> student's point of view. Grant it, *Darby probably over did it. *Dar*by
> knew that he was probably stepping over the line. But, why ban *&Narb-ik?
>
> I was in *Narb--iks class, alongside *Da---rby, when *Dar*by was banned by
> P*aul B@orghese. There is one thing *Dar*by was right about. When it comes
> to high quality hardcore boot camps, *^Nar--bik's class is a real threat to
> &^Cert-Scie_nce and several other companies. I know. I attended the
> Cer-t-sci-ence boot camp. Unless you want to be ripped off $8K+, I wouldn't
> recommend the program, period. I have also attended INX and Netmasterclass.
> *Nar*bi-k, INX and NetMasterClass are worth every penny. I have never
> attended Scott Morris' class, but I have met the man and he is clearly a
> hardcore CCIE much like N*ar*bik, INX, and Netmasterclass. You cannot go
> wrong with any of these guys, for the exception of one.
>
> Nonetheless, I have not seen *Nar--bik push his class, like some others
> have. I have never seen him attach huge or sometimes obnoxious signature
> blocks like some others. I have not seen *Narbi--k advertise his class in
> any way, other than to inform someone to email him directly, if they had
> questions about his class. So, why ban *Narb--ik??? He has contributed to
> so many passing their labs by answering so many questions that others could
> not do on their own. Just as Scott, Brian Dennis, Brian McGahan, Bruce
> Caslow, Bob Sinclair and several others have done.
>
> *Narb-ik$ had nothing but good things to say about Scott Morris,
> Internetwork-experts, and Netmaster's.
> He just never had anything to say about C*ert-Sc*ience.
> You know; if you don't have anything good to say..........??? Hmmmmm....
> CertScience...... Paul Borghese...... Ban &Narb**ik....... Has the the
> Patriot Act has come to GS....??? I know, I know. That was a bit much. But
> still, it does beg for questions when looking at the motivation for banning
> *Narb*ik.
> Why not ban all instructors from training companies, if there are so many
> complaints about this stuff?
>
> Complaints?? The IPExpert, Netmasterclass and Internetwork Experts have
> nothing to worry about.
> Their reputation precedes them. If others are threatened by it, then they
> need to step up the quality of their CCIE boot camp learning experience, as
> well as their level of professionalism. Or better yet, go beyond the norm.
> The point of competition is to push the limits, find better ways and
> hopefully, increase the quality of just about anything, including the
> learning experience. If a CCIE hopeful asks for feedback about any persons
> experience in reference to any one of the CCIE boot camps, the GS door is
> going to open. And it will swing both ways. Former students are going to
> chime in. It is the nature of the beast on this forum.
>
> It seems to me that if you want to create a forum for pure CCIE studies,
> without this adolescent bickering crap, then simply dis-allow any form of
> advertisement or promotion altogether. Including the *CertScience signature
> automatically attached to the bottom of the GS emails. If it cannot be
> stopped, then try to
> control it via a solution. GS is and has been the
> largest CCIE forum in the world. So, why not let it pay for itself. Paid
> advertisements??? Maybe a banner or set of links at the bottom of all GS
> emails. Anyone caught advertising or promoting anything beyond the
> banner/links, will be kicked off. Simple as that. If it is too difficult
> to "police" the forum on this level, oh well. It is, unfortunately, one of
> those problems to which a solution will need to be found.
> Or..... just deal with the problem. Hey, just shutdown GS? Problem solved.
>
>
> My $.02 worth Wait, now its $.0125.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nobody@groupstudy.com
> [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of CCIE
> Sent: Sunday, April 13, 2008 10:15 AM
> To: 'Ramy Sisy'; 'ccie girl'; 'Cisco certification'
> Subject: RE: OT Darby
>
> What do you mean "Nar---bik is not showing since 18 JAN???
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nobody@groupstudy.com
> [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of Ramy Sisy
> Sent: Saturday, April 12, 2008 9:59 PM
> To: 'ccie girl'; 'Cisco certification'
> Subject: RE: OT Darby
>
> Probably he was filtered after his last post "Nar
>
> bik's Bootcamp Chronicles - Day 1".
>
> Also Nar
>
> bik, he is not showing since 18 Jan?!
>
>
> -----------------------------------------------
> Thanks,
> Ramy Sisy
> CCIE#17321 (Security), CCSI#30417
> http://www.linkedin.com/in/RAMYSISY
>
> CCIE Security Content Manager/ Technical Instructor
> http://www.CCBOOTCAMP.com
> -----------------------------------------------
>
> "Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more
> violent. It takes a touch of genius - and a lot of courage - to move in the
> opposite direction" Albert Einstein
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nobody@groupstudy.com
> [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of ccie girl
> Sent: Saturday, April 12, 2008 2:53 PM
> To: Cisco certification
> Subject: OT Darby
>
> ..is it just me or does anyone else miss Mr Weaver's input?
>
> I hope he is OK.
>
>
> Pass the CCIE in six weeks, Guaranteed!
> http://www.certscience.com/CCIE
> _______________________________________________________________________
> Subscription information may be found at:
> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>
>
> Pass the CCIE in six weeks, Guaranteed!
> http://www.certscience.com/CCIE
> _______________________________________________________________________
> Subscription information may be found at:
> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>
>
> Pass the CCIE in six weeks, Guaranteed!
> http://www.certscience.com/CCIE
> _______________________________________________________________________
> Subscription information may be found at:
> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>
>
>
>
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