From: Narbik Kocharians (narbikk@gmail.com)
Date: Mon Nov 19 2007 - 18:34:45 ART
This is one reason to go for the second one.
On 11/19/07, Gary Duncanson <gary.duncanson@googlemail.com> wrote:
>
> hehehe yeah flame on..
>
> But I got labs to do!
>
> I still don't think 20000 CCIE's is a lot in the grand scheme of things.
> Hell,
> I remember one time after another long day in the IT biz making a note to
> myself that numbers were rising and I better get a move on before we hit
> 20000. I made that note in 2001! It's taken six years to finally get
> close to
> that number!
>
> Just before we all forget, the thread was started by Joe who passed his
> CCIE.
>
> Congrats again Joe!
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: darth router
> To: Gary Duncanson
> Cc: Joseph Brunner ; ccielab@groupstudy.com
> Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 8:29 PM
> Subject: Re: CCIE 19366
>
>
>
>
> I don't think the number game is just fear. If there is enough doubt of
> paper CCIEs on this board of all places, its out there in the market, and
> the
> real world. The devaluing of the certification is inevitable over time
> with
> mass consumption. I am not saying it will ever be like a CCNA. That is a
> bit
> insane, but less valuable over time depending on how many of us are
> flooding
> the market, you betcha. So why are so many people passing? Materials,
> dynamips, brain dumps, ciscos mcdonaldsizing of the track, etc... I don't
> think nailing craploads of CCIEs is the answer either, just being a good
> engineer is what really matters, right? Cisco would like us to think we
> need
> to nail more CCIEs, or even the vendors have invested interest in that
> approach (sorry guys, nothing personal). It makes them lots of $$$$$$
>
> Flame on...
>
>
>
>
>
> On 11/19/07, Gary Duncanson <gary.duncanson@googlemail.com> wrote:
> Correct. Or has what it takes. Opening up more testing seats does not
> necessarily mean an exponential increase in pass numbers. It just makes
> it
> easier to schedule a slot and tank the lab.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Joseph Brunner" <joe@affirmedsystems.com>
> To: <subodh.rawat@wipro.com>; < gary.duncanson@googlemail.com>;
> <Andrew.Usankin@twtelecom.com>
> Cc: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
> Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 6:43 PM
> Subject: RE: CCIE 19366
>
>
> > Wrong.
> >
> > Not that many people will commit what it takes.
> >
> > They just wont
> >
> > More seats? That's like saying if Mercedes makes more 600 V12
> biturbo's
> > CL-65's they will just be sold. There has to be demand and qualified
> > "buyers"
> >
> > -Joe
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf
> Of
> > subodh.rawat@wipro.com
> > Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 1:03 PM
> > To: gary.duncanson@googlemail.com; Andrew.Usankin@twtelecom.com
> > Cc: ccielab@groupstudy.com
> > Subject: RE: CCIE 19366
> >
> > I think if Cisco makes 200 seats per day, there will be atleast 24000
> > CCIEs per year (considering 50% failure) or if failure is 25 % (which
> is
> > most likely the case in today's scenario) then this figure will be
> > atleast 36000 per year.
> >
> > I am not sure then this club will remain as exclusive as it is today.
> I
> > think Cisco should not increase seats from what it has capacity
> today,
> > (there was some noise sometime back that Cisco is going to open new
> > centers; no doubt it will help many people in many ways and I am no
> > exception) if they want to retain CCIE's value intact or else CCIE is
> > next CCNA or CCNP for that matter (definitely it takes atleast 10-12
> > months hard core study but today it is still very much possible to
> clear
> > in first attempt).
> >
> > But as I said in my earlier post, only knowledge will prevail not
> number
> > even if we are 1xCCIE or 5xCCIE.
> >
> > Thanks
> > Subodh
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto: nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf
> Of
> > Gary Duncanson
> > Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 11:01 PM
> > To: Usankin, Andrew
> > Cc: ccielab@groupstudy.com
> > Subject: Re: CCIE 19366
> >
> > I agree it's a personal thing. For my part I still believe getting
> the
> > CCIE is a remarkable achievement. People have gone about rising
> numbers
> > ever since the program took off in the late 1990's. The fact remains
> > that the CCIE is difficult to obtain. There is an intellectual
> > requirement to passing this thing but perhaps just as important is
> the
> > degree of personal commitment and determination it takes to clear it.
> > People's milage will vary depending on freetime available to chase
> the
> > CCIE but regardless it still remains very difficult to get through it
> > whatever ligitimate resources you have at your disposal. You still
> have
> > to put the long hours and the hard miles in and that's something many
> > people still come up short on committing to. I know one CCIE who had
> the
> > best part of a year off work on full pay by his employer to
> concentrate
> > on preparing for the lab. Labbooks and books were paid for, so was
> rack
> > access, so were exam fees and flights..even a bootcamp was thrown in.
> > The guy studied hard. It took him 4 attempts to clear it a few years
> > ago.
> >
> > Literally hundreds of thousands of engineers have failed on the
> journey
> > to become a CCIE over the years. When you consider that the program
> has
> > been going 10 years and that less than 20000 CCIE's worldwide have
> > cleared the lab so I would say it's still a pretty exclusive club.
> >
> > Gary
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Usankin, Andrew" < Andrew.Usankin@twtelecom.com>
> > To: "Cisco certification" <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
> > Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 4:45 PM
> > Subject: RE: CCIE 19366
> >
> >
> >> Everybody should decide for himself, but as to me - CCIE is not a
> >> remarkable achievement anymore. Take a loot at the number, it says
> it
> >> all. So if you still want to get to the hall of fame, you should get
> > at
> >> least two CCIE, three is better, 5 - is a group of people whom you
> can
> >> count on your fingers. :)
> >>
> >> Andrew
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf
> > Of
> >> Gregory Gombas
> >> Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 5:47 PM
> >> To: A.G. Ananth Sarma (GMail)
> >> Cc: Cisco certification
> >> Subject: Re: CCIE 19366
> >>
> >> Me too. I guarantee you it will soon say in job postings "CCIE with
> >> number below 20000 preferred". Cause you know after 20000 the CCIE
> is
> >> easy :-)
> >>
> >> On Nov 17, 2007 9:22 AM, A.G. Ananth Sarma (GMail)
> >> <ananth.sarma@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>> Congrats Joseph,
> >>>
> >>> By the way guys, the number really ticks very fast.
> >>>
> >>> I would like to catch up before it reaches 20k.
> >>>
> >>> Regards,
> >>>
> >>> Ananth
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Nov 17, 2007 8:55 AM, darth router <darklordrouter@gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > Grats Joseph. Whats next?
> >>> >
> >>> > DR
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > On 11/16/07, Gregory Gombas <ggombas@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>> > >
> >>> > > Congrats Joe! Very well deserved! I could tell from the way you
> >>> > > were banging out configs in our group study session that I
> would
> >>> > > see your number soon.
> >>> > >
> >>> > > Security eh...that would be my choice for a second CCIE.
> >>> > > How bout I get this pesky R+S lab out of the way and we can
> fire
> >>> > > up the Security webex!
> >>> > >
> >>> > > Warmest Regards,
> >>> > > Greg
> >>> > >
> >>> > >
> >>> > > On Nov 16, 2007 6:55 AM, Joseph Brunner <
> joe@affirmedsystems.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>> > > > First I want to thank god for all he has given me.
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > > Second I would like to thank Howard, Bobby (RTP), Tom and
> Tong
> >>> > > > (SJ)
> >>> the
> >>> > > > proctors who work so hard to keep the lab running as smooth
> as
> >>> > > > it
> >>> does.
> >>> > > You
> >>> > > > are gentlemen, and even when I walked out with nothing and
> knew
> >>> > > > it, I
> >>> > > felt
> >>> > > > honored to challenge your creation.
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > > Next I would like to Thank Brian Dennis, Brian McGahan, Scott
> >>> > > > Morris
> >>> and
> >>> > > > Narbik Kocharians. It's one thing to get your number and just
> >>> > > > sit in
> >>> the
> >>> > > > corner somewhere. It's a crowning achievement to use it to
> help
> >>> > > > others
> >>> > > share
> >>> > > > your achievement. Your participation here was a huge study
> >>> > > > motivation
> >>> to
> >>> > > me.
> >>> > > > Narbik I touched your name on the wall in RTP yesterday
> before
> > I
> >>> started
> >>> > > and
> >>> > > > I knew it was time.
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > > Got to run, before somebody picks my security blueprint off
> the
> >>> printer.
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > > Thanks!
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > > Joseph L. Brunner
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > > CCIE #19366
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >
> >>>
> >
> ______________________________________________________________________
> >>> _
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> >>> > >
> >>> > >
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> >>> >
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> >>
> >>
> >
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-- Narbik Kocharians CCIE# 12410 (R&S, SP, Security) CCSI# 30832 www.Net-WorkBooks.com
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