From: Larry Letterman \(lletterm\) (lletterm@cisco.com)
Date: Mon Apr 16 2007 - 11:48:06 ART
I know a few companies have quit the H-1B process..and are hiring local
talent
For jobs opened here...a move that suits me ....
**************************
Larry Letterman
Cisco Systems
**************************
$-----Original Message-----
$From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On
$Behalf Of Darby Weaver
$Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 7:32 AM
$To: Darby Weaver; Lab Dude; Dan C
$Cc: Usman Ali; Anthony Bonilla; Darby Weaver; CCIEwnaB;
$ccielab@groupstudy.com
$Subject: Re: Why not to use the "real ccie lab" folks
$
$457 jobs on dice and 474 jobs on monster for just CCIE. This
$number has hovered here for the past 5+ years that I have
$watched it - never seems to make it to 500 over under 400...
$Really strange but I believe it is true, no matter how many
$get certified.
$
$Now not all those jobs are truly CCIE jobs, but some of the
$CCIE's among us need a place to get even more hands-on.
$
$Dice only has 94,000 jobs open at the moment, does not bode
$well for the H-1B's though. Unless more jobs come from somewhere else.
$
$
$--- Darby Weaver <darbyweaver@yahoo.com> wrote:
$
$> Why not give Cisco ideas?
$>
$> They obviously are making changes right now. The seats are booked
$> clear till August and new seats are not being made available clearly
$> for a reason.
$>
$> Those at networkers will here why first.
$>
$> Many who pass the lab have told how they passed it in or around 3+
$> hours to under 5, so it could be harder to get the other 3
$hours worth
$> of our time.
$> Especially if so many are completing it so quickly, it is obviously
$> not a tough and grueling 8-hour exam and if it is those of us, me
$> included, have just not been up to par.
$>
$> Let them make it tougher, it cannot hurt the value of the cert. And
$> those of us trying so hard to get it will get what we paid
$for when we
$> do eventually get it.
$>
$> No harm done there.
$> --- Lab Dude <ccielabdude@gmail.com> wrote:
$>
$> > CCIE lab is tough enough. Do we really need to
$> make
$> > it even more miserable
$> > by giving Cisco some new ideas?
$> >
$> > At the end of the day, either you know your stuff
$> or
$> > you dont know it. If
$> > you dont know your stuff, regardless of your 'CCIE
$number', you are
$> > not going to last very long at your work place because sooner or
$> > later you'd get found out.
$> >
$> > As far as real labs go, even if people know the questions, taking
$> > the t'shooting that goes into account, I seriously
$> doubt
$> > that they can pass even
$> > if they mug every question up 100%. If someone doesnt even
$know the
$> > basics, knowing the questions may not necessarily help him/her.
$> >
$> > My $0.02
$> >
$> >
$> > On 4/16/07, Dan C <cdan2154@gmail.com> wrote:
$> > >
$> > > Hi all,
$> > >
$> > > I like the idea Usman put forward by the time
$> > those guys attempt to
$> > > memorise
$> > > 100 labs they will be CCIE's ready without
$> knowing
$> > :) Maybe another way to
$> > > move forward is for Cisco to have a live
$> interview
$> > before the day of the
$> > > exam, where you may need to answer few basic
$> > questions and prove that you
$> > > have the experience needed to move to the next
$> > level... who knows....
$> > > my2cents, Dan
$> > >
$> > > On 4/17/07, Usman Ali <usman198@gmail.com>
$> wrote:
$> > > >
$> > > > Hello all Gurus ,
$> > > > I think it is very desperate for the people
$> who
$> > are doing CCIE by
$> > > studying
$> > > > .
$> > > > i am working on ccie from last 1 year and quit
$> > job only for study and my
$> > > > target to pass CCIE in three attempts , if i pass end of this
$> > > > year what will be the
$> > market of ccie after 3 years
$> > > > when there would be more than 50000 CCIE and a
$> > few thousands with good
$> > > > knowledge ,
$> > > > it is very disappointing position is it better to go with IBM
$> > > > certification to
$> > earn IBM cert you need just
$> > > > a few configurations and once a redbook study
$> of
$> > the technology , i
$> > > > passed IBM SAN solution desinger examine 3
$> years
$> > before and it is more
$> > > > easy than even CCNA and have a good market
$> > value too .
$> > > > can cisco make a huge data base of some 100
$> labs
$> > you will get one in
$> > > > examine or something like this to avoid the
$> > fraud .
$> > > >
$> > > > bye
$> > > >
$> > > > Usman Ali
$> > > >
$> > > > Anthony Bonilla wrote:
$> > > > > On the same note, one of the proctors in RTP
$> > was mentioning that they
$> > > > know
$> > > > > that lab exams are leaking out being that
$> > whenever Cisco releases a
$> > > new
$> > > > > exam, the passing rate is real low but after
$> > two weeks or so, the
$> > > > passing
$> > > > > rate shoots up to 90% - go figure!
$> > > > >
$> > > > > When everyone in the room asked why Cisco
$> does
$> > not do anything about
$> > > it,
$> > > > he
$> > > > > replied that they can't do anything there
$> > because China has no NDA or
$> > > > > something to that affect. Or better yet,
$> > Cisco should offering this
$> > > > exam in
$> > > > > those countries to begin with but if this
$> > continues to go on and Cisco
$> > > > does
$> > > > > not do anything knowing all this is
$> happening,
$> > you always wonder if
$> > > they
$> > > > > themselves are involved as well???
$> > > > >
$> > > > > Just my 2 cents.
$> > > > >
$> > > > >
$> > > > > On 4/15/07, Darby Weaver
$> > <darbyweaver@yahoo.com> wrote:
$> > > > >
$> > > > >> What everyone on this list in a position to
$> > hire
$> > > > >> should do, could do, and ought to do with
$> > every single
$> > > > >> job candidate, CCIE notwithstanding, is set
$> > them down
$> > > > >> in front of some gear and let them show you
$> > how and
$> > > > >> why they are the person for the job...
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> 2-3 hours in front of gear and you know
$> > whether you
$> > > > >> have a keeper or... NOT.
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> Lots of people are passing the lab these
$> past
$> > few
$> > > > >> years...
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> Not all of them are quite qualified to work
$> > on a
$> > > > >> full-fledged network with "issues". I'm
$> sure
$> > most of
$> > > > >> have worked hard and some for some years,
$> but
$> > a few
$> > > > >> squeak by.
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> So... if everyone here and everywhere else
$> > maintains
$> > > > >> good hiring practices, then I suspect that
$> we
$> > will not
$> > > > >> have this problem of people passing the lab
$> > and
$> > > > >> getting digits by any means necessary.
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> Not is they know that the cert alone is not
$> a
$> > rubber
$> > > > >> stamp to a CCIE-Level position.
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> However with a quick romp to the job boards
$> > and seeing
$> > > > >> postings like:
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> CCNA required and CCIE desired... with MCSE
$> > or CNE or
$> > > > >> Unix experience and oh yes, we want the
$> > candidate to
$> > > > >> install MS SQL or MS Exchange or even
$> handle
$> > desktop
$> > > > >> support issues and Symantec AV etc...
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> Hmmm... What is the point...
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> Also be careful to apply to jobs that are
$> of
$> > a CCIE
$> > > > >> caliber as well - once you get the grail.
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> =====================================
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> One more thing, did anyone ever consider
$> that
$> > maybe,
$> > > > >> just maybe, Cisco is the one putting out
$> the
$> > "real
$> > > > >> CCIE Labs" and if they are I suppose the
$> > proctors have
$> > > > >> a lot of fun watching things not quite work
$> > for
$> > > > >> candidates whenever they pass through...
$> > Here's a
$> > > > >> little but not quite a lot...
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> That is kind of sadistic... Especially
$> since
$> > they may
$> > > > >> even have the names of the buyers...
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> Hey - how many people come report back on
$> GS
$> > and say
$> > > > >> they cannot figure out what went wrong...
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> Hah!
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> LOL
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> Hmmm...
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> Close but no cigar...
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >> --- CCIEwnaB <cciewnab@gmail.com> wrote:
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >>
$> > > > >>> OK smart peeps,
$> > > > >>>
$> > > > >>> I have a friend who is currently working
$> on
$> > her
$> > > > >>> CCNP, and keeps giving me a
$> > > > >>> hard time for not having passed the lab
$> yet
$> > (1
$> > > > >>> failed attempt under my belt) but I'm still
$hitting it hard
$> > > > >>> and will be
$> > going back
$> > > > >>> in another 2 moths.
$> > > > >>>
$> > > > >>> Anyway, she's convinced that when she
$> > finishes her
$> > > > >>> last NP test she'll just
$> > > > >>> pay the $1200 to the folks who shall
$> remian
$> > nameless
$> > > > >>> and study the "3 real
$> > > > >>> CCIE labs" and pass on the first attempt."
$> I
$> > agree
$> > > > >>> with what's been said
$> > > > >>> here so many times before, that the cert
$> > only means
$> > > > >>> something if you truly
$> > > > >>> are an expert and have earned it. So let's
$> > not get
$> > > > >>> everyone all wound up.
$> > > > >>>
$> > > > >>> That being said, does anyone have a few
$> > stories I
$> > > > >>> can share with her, that
$> > > > >>> might be helpfull in keeping her on the
$> > "HIGH ROAD".
$> > > > >>> I keep trying to tell
$> > > > >>> her, she's going to pay $1200 for a couple
$> > useless
$> > > > >>> old files and then what,
$> > > > >>> go to the proctor on test day and say, hey
$> > this
$> > > > >>> isn't the test I was
$> > > > >>> expecting you must have made a mistake?
$> > > > >>>
$> > > > >>> I'm sure there are other folks here who
$> have
$> > fallen
$> > > > >>> for it, please share
$> > > > >>> your experiences so my friend will see the
$> > light and
$> > > > >>> not surrender to the
$> > > > >>> dark side...she knows who she is
$> > > > >>>
$> > > > >>>
$> > > > >>>
$> > > > >>
$> > >
$> >
$>
$_______________________________________________________________________
$> > > > >>
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$> > > > >>>
$> > > > >>
$> > >
$> >
$>
$_______________________________________________________________________
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$> > >
$> >
$>
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