From: Howard C. Berkowitz (hcb@gettcomm.com)
Date: Tue Mar 23 2004 - 23:19:45 GMT-3
At 9:01 PM -0500 3/23/04, Scott Morris wrote:
>Now Howard.... This "is" not something that is necessarily specific to this
>profession or certification. In all walks of life I come across people who
>should not be allowed in front of customers or damn-near anyone for that
>matter because of their inate inability to converse in any sort of
>professional level.
:-) to say that effective communications will give an advantage to
people that cannot do so remains an advantage. The most essential,
however, is usually that they can communicate well in the particular
language of their activity. For example, talking to Jedi Masters
when, Force means you words not in order right put do.
>
>Whether a good thing or a bad thing, not very many professions have useful
>requirements like public speaking, business conversation, writing (technical
>or otherwise) or anything like that.
>
>Whether we view this as a sad state of the world, or just a lack in
>professional standards I'm not quite sure. I have met CCIE's who can't
>reasonably subnet.
This isn't communications. This is incompetence.
>I have met doctors and nurses much more comfortable with
>inanimate objects that measure things in exciting ways but don't speak
As someone who deals regularly with clinical environments, I very
consciously shift into speaking native "doctor" when that is the
local tongue. That isn't just a matter of vocabulary, but of the
approach to problems. There are many, many times when I speak to a
medical person for about 2-3 minutes, and they start addressing me as
"doctor", or at least the conversation becomes high-content for me,
while perhaps unintelligible to others. If push comes to shove, I do
a fair impression of a particularly crochety and tenured medical
school professor.
It turns out that both formal medical presentations, as well as quick
dumps of critical information in the ER, are highly structured. There
is no attempt to be cute; there is a very serious attempt to be
unambiguous. It's rare that seconds count in medicine -- although I
can think of a few cases -- but definitely there are times where a
minute or two delay can mean the difference between life and death.
How often is someone under time pressure here such that they cannot
spell out "you" or "computer"?
I've heard detectives say that getting someone to confess is the art
of selling them the idea that jail is desirable. How many times, I
wonder, do some of the more experienced members of this list see a
subject line such as "Urgent problem!" and reflect that they have no
clue as to either the nature of the problem (and whether they are
expert on it), or why the poster's lack of preparedness should
constitute the responder's emergency?
Admittedly, it can be a useful skills for political candidates to
speak apparently grammatical sentences for several minutes, and not
actually take a definitive position on anything.
>. I
>have met attorneys who are proficient at arguing to the expense of being
>able to hold a conversation where no "winner" exists.
I shall defer to the legal refugees of the list to comment on this category.
>I have met McDonalds'
>employees who appear amazed that cheese is REALLY supposed to be on a
>Quarter Pounder (because the "w/cheese" is in lower-case which must make it
>optional).
If it makes you feel any better, I prefer my fast food hamburgers
WITHOUT cheese, and it's just as much trouble to get it left off. A
_good_ hamburger with blue or swiss cheese is quite another matter.
>
>So... I guess, my dear Jedi Master, it depends on what your definition of
>"is" is... Hmmmm...
>
>;)
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
>Howard C. Berkowitz
>Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 12:39 PM
>To: ccielab@groupstudy.com
>Subject: Re: NetMasterClass training
>
>At 5:05 PM +0000 3/23/04, jgraun@comcast.net wrote:
>>Thank you Tom I am glad you understand what must be done. You see, I
>>have meet CCIE's that cannot redistribute between two routing protocols
> >and dont know what proxy arp is! Why is that everybody has this
>>opinion that going into the computer field is easy?! Do you see
>>construction workers switching to become CPA's or Lawyers?
>>NO! And there is a reason. I have seen too many people that have no
>>business touching a production system getting paid well and being
>>idiots. It is very frustrating when you have all these hacks that
>>think they are your peer and they cannot spell the word computer.
>>
>
>Frustrating? An understatement, and I speak literally of your
>example. Something I see all too frequently on groupstudy is very
>nonstandard spelling, probably in the style of people who make much
>use of instant messaging. I can understand this, to an extent, for
>people for whom English is not their first language, because they may
>not see as much proper writing.
>
>While it isn't formally part of any Cisco exam, the ability to write
>coherent and professional English is going to be important in getting
>through hiring and, at the very least, advancing in the job.
>Ignoring Dilbertian Pointy-Haired Bosses, one of the distinguishing
>marks of someone that moves up the professional ladder is the ability
>to teach, the ability to document well enough that someone can
>understand what they did without personal interpretation, and the
>ability to communicate to nontechnical managers and clients.
>
>"What u have 2 do 2 ur puter" simply doesn't cut it [0]. It doesn't
>even improve communication here. In many respects, this mailing list
>is a practice environment for real jobs. It's as good a place as any
>to get into the habits of clear writing.
>
>
>[0] I am _not_ going to be drawn into Clintonian discussions of the meaning
> of "it" or "is". Fool Yoda not is!
>
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