From: P729 (p729@xxxxxxx)
Date: Thu Aug 15 2002 - 15:52:51 GMT-3
I didn't mean to come off as an English bigot--if I did, my apologies to all
non-native English speakers. I believe the qualities I cited can be
applicable to any language. Believe me, all native English speakers do not
have a lock on effective communications. If you've ever tried to listen to
Ozzy Osbourne speak you'd know what I mean :)
I have the utmost respect for those that can communicate using English as a
secondary language. With all of its tortured and convoluted rules, I've got
to believe it's one of the hardest languages to master for a non-native
speaker. And what makes it extra hard for those in this field is a lot of
technical jargon simply doesn't translate very well (if at all) into other
languages, since the jargon itself is kind of like its own language...
Regards,
Mas Kato
https://ecardfile.com/id/mkato
----- Original Message -----
From: "IPSec" <ipsec@myrealbox.com>
To: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
Cc: <p729@cox.net>
Sent: Thursday, August 15, 2002 10:52 AM
Subject: OT : RE: Current salaries and recruiters w/attitudes
Mas Kato,
I couldn't agree more with you on the point of effective communication
skills.
But all I want to say is, it's much easier to say than to do. It might not
be a big deal at all for all of you, native English speakers, most of whom I
have met just simply take it for granted. (and of course that's natural and
nothing wrong with it.)
I believe that most of foreign members on the list would concor in that
learning a foreign language other than native tongue is a no easy task to
accomplish.
To study and get to the college-level of language skill itself might well
consistitute another CCIE-like long and tough journey....
After I got my number recently, I've been thinking about what to do next.
Now I know what I need to study.....
my thoughts and worth of 2c.....off to community college to check out ESL
curricula.
Thanks!
...furthermore, while the willingness to share experience and knowledge is
wonderful, I believe the ability to communicate that experience and
knowledge _effectively_ is just as important. Critical thinking, considerate
choice of communications method and basic college-level spelling and grammar
skills--along with the aforementioned attributes, separate the best from the
rest.
Regards,
Mas Kato
https://ecardfile.com/id/mkato
----- Original Message -----
From: "Hansang Bae" <hbae@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2002 8:37 PM
Subject: Re: OT : RE: Current salaries and recruiters w/attitudes
At 10:04 AM 8/15/2002 +0800, Donny MATEO wrote:
>I dunno about the rest of you, but I have had bad experience in this so
called experience stuff. It's not always true that one with 10 years
experience would be better than one with 3 years experience. I think it all
boils down to what kind of person are you and what did you do in that years
of job exposure. If you just sit down maintaining your systems for 10 years,
and the other guy with 3 years experience is working his butt off, solving
problem, troubleshooting and improving the system, I would favor the 3 years
one. Personal experience I know ppl with experience more than mine that
doesn't even know how to configure ISDN correctly or how EIGRP works.(yeah
EIGRP, don't even bother to ask about the rest..and yes..they are network
engineers).
>Point is experience is not a measurement of how good they are, it's just a
measure of how long they've been in the field, which doesn't necessarily
means they are better. Of course there are also lots of other guys who've
been in the field longer than I, with knowledge that kept me thinking, how
the hell he can cope up with all those kowledge in his head. This is a
personal opinion, just wanting to share with some of you. There is no point
to debate it, ppl has different opinion and I respect that.
I absolutely agree with you. One thing I say to people is that "just
because you've been doing it for 10 years doesn't mean you've been doing it
right!"
The experience I'm talking about is someon who has in depth knowledge PCs,
Servers, Routers, Switches, etc.etc.etc. The guy with all the info in his
head - as you put it.
Of course just as important is his/her willingness to share that
information.
hsb
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