From: Thomas Larus (tlarus@xxxxxxx)
Date: Tue Dec 18 2001 - 14:11:09 GMT-3
You must have scheduled a lab exam if you are on this list. Then you
must know that there are not 15-20 seats per testing center. You can
tell roughly how many seats there are by looking at open dates in the
distant future. As far as I can tell there are a bunch of seats in
Brussells (12 or more), but far fewer in other locations.4-6 in RTP, a
few more in SJ. I have not checked in a while, so I don't know if these
estimates are accurate, but I would be willing to bet that the average
number of seats for the whole program works out to be less than 8, the
low end of your speculative range.
Also, I have heard that at least one lab is a practice lab on weekdays
and a test lab on weekends only. This could be Bangalore, which is not
in the on-line system, so may not be in your figures, anyway, but there
may be other testing centers that do not run many test dates per week.
There is no question but that Cisco improved their bottom line by going
to a one-day format, but I do not believe that they run this as a profit
center. The real benefit to Cisco is that they are encouraging a whole
lot of networking folks to become extremely knowledgeable about,
comfortable with, and invested in their IOS and their equipment. Yes,
many of us would love to work with some Junipers and a few other pieces
of equipment, but, all in all, we will tend to prefer working with the
IOS that we have grown to feel comfortable with. (Yes, I know we may
get sick of some things, and we learn about more bugs and flaws than we
ever wanted to know existed, but all in all we will favor Cisco).
Second, massive quantities of used Cisco equipment are grabbed up by
Cisco students. This helps support the price of new equipment by
reducing the "overhang" effect of used equipment. The fact that am
end-of-life Cat5000 still has some cash value is due largely to its
demand in CCIE and CCNP practice labs. I would venture that if there
were no Cisco cert programs, a business could pick up a used 2503 for a
small branch office or home office for about 150 dollars. The used
price is considerable higher because of demand from Cisco cert students.
Cisco and the market hold out the carrot of interesting work and good
money, and I follow it. I am enjoying the journey and I have gone too
far to turn back now. I hope the effort and investment pay off in my
career, and I believe they will, but I will have enjoyed the journey
anyway.
Thomas Larus
-----Original Message-----
From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
Jason Graun
Sent: Tuesday, December 18, 2001 9:25 AM
To: 'Troy Rader'; ccielab@groupstudy.com
Subject: RE: ccie stats
I been to a lab but I am going to comment on numbers etc... for obvious
reasons, plus I respect the CCIE program. Even if they are making 50+
Million off the exam, there are many expenses, the proctors are not
cheap, and I assume they all have nice 6-figure salaries. In addition,
the space the labs take up costs money, especially if Cisco is renting
the space. The utility bills, new equipment (granted they own the
stuff, somebody still has to be paid to build the devices) and other
miscellaneous costs that we cant think of. I used to consult for a
major telecom company that was a competitor to Cisco and when I was in
budget meetings is was unreal the amount of hidden costs I would never
have thought of and sometimes the amount of wasted funds. Cisco might
be making a profit off the CCIE lab exam and that might have to be done
in order to keep the program viable in the eyes of the Cisco big-boys
and the brass. Therefore, in my opinion the program is even better now
then 2years ago when I decided to embark on becoming a CCIE.
Jason
-----Original Message-----
From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
Troy Rader
Sent: Monday, December 17, 2001 11:49 PM
To: ccielab@groupstudy.com
Subject: OT: ccie stats
Seriously off topic. Do not read on if you dislike off topic comments.
Instead of studying, I am doing stupid math like this...
Curious what anyone else thinks of my numbers.
I had to make quite a few assumptions, and that's the correction I'm
looking for from this group.
>From what I can tell on CCO, there are 11 test sites world wide. I
assume
all are open 7 days per week (possibly not though). I assume the each
seats 10 - 20 candidates. I'll say they are closed 30 days out of the
year for holidays, etc, leaving 335 days open, at 11 sites, with an avg
15
people per day per site. 15 may be too high. I just don't know. But,
11
x 15 is 165 people taking the test every day globally. 165 x 335 is
55,275 people taking the test each year. Even if 15 is too high, and we
say 10, it's 36,850 taking the test each year. Or even 8 people avg per
day per site. That is 29,480. Prior to Oct 1, and the test change, and
possibly 9/11, the pass rate seemed to be around 200+ per month. Now it
seems to be more like 100+ per month. If we assume 1500 pass per year
now, taking the 29,480 number, that is a total pass rate of 5%, not
caring
about # of attempts, etc. If we go ahead and take the 55,275 #, that is
only 2.7% passing the test.
Even more interesting, perhaps, is that at $1250 each, ignoring that
Cisco
probably doesn't pay themselves for their own people to test, at 55,275
test takers per year, that's a cool $69 million Cisco takes in. Even at
only 29,480 test takers, that $37 million. I'm not suggesting that they
are or are not making money. I think they should. Just numbers to look
at
instead of studing...
Any comments? Fatal flaws in my assumptions?
Please no flames. I included OT in the subject. You read it by choice.
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