Re: cisco lab safe

Actually that is a good point, if their 1st time pass rate was so high they
wouldn't need to offer that would they? The 1st time pass rate alone would
sell it for them...

On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 8:18 PM, netwkengr <netwkengr_at_gmail.com> wrote:

> That makes me nervous. It just tells me they anticipate you to fail
> using the Cisco 360 Program :)
>
> On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 4:12 PM, Wayne Lawson <groupstudy_at_ipexpert.com>
> wrote:
> > Guys....On a serious note here - Cisco is giving away free retakes (if
> you
> > spend a lot of money) on the 360 program (if you pay twice as much as us
> > "gray market" providers) - I'm wondering what ther class retake policy
> is.
> > Are 360 vendors forced to allow free retakes of the class you take and
> pay
> > for? Also, are there guaranteed updates on the self-study materials if
> the
> > blueprint changes. Seriously - I don't know the answer to this - I'm just
> > trying to get my arms around the truth and "marketing fluff"....
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Wayne A. Lawson II - CCIE #5244
> > Founder & President - IPexpert, Inc.
> > Mailto: wlawson_at_ipexpert.com
> > Mobile: +1.810.334.1564
> >
> > :: Message sent from iPhone.
> >
> > On Sep 15, 2009, at 7:00 PM, Dark Fiber <darkfiber08_at_gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Narbik is in the 360 program though ;) His workbooks and teaching and
> >> their
> >> mock labs...
> >>
> >> On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 6:58 PM, Darby Weaver
> >> <darby.weaver_at_gmail.com>wrote:
> >>
> >>> Hey...
> >>>
> >>> Compare the number of 360 CCIE's in telast 2 years over at NMC to the
> >>> number of CCIE's from IPexpert and InternetworkExpert...
> >>>
> >>> Never mind Narbik who's killing the 360 single-handedly.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Why should you pay more for materials that have not been updated in 2-3
> >>> years other than interfaces?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 6:45 PM, <armylegionmedic_at_aol.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Awesome, I see I did misunderstand and this clears up a lot. I would
> >>>> have
> >>>> to say then based on things from Cisco being a requirement and really
> >>>> adding
> >>>> in a lot of back end costs, then you are absolutely correct. Cisco 360
> >>>> is
> >>>> extremely expensive and the free retake is just a marketing tool, that
> >>>> in
> >>>> some ways you are actually paying for. Like buying a car and they talk
> >>>> about
> >>>> well, we are going to charge you an extra $500 dollars, BUT just for
> >>>> that we
> >>>> will throw in a free air freshner. ?:-) YYYAAAYYY!!! SOLD!
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> -----Original Message-----
> >>>> From: Scott Morris <smorris_at_ine.com>
> >>>> To: armylegionmedic_at_aol.com
> >>>> Cc: darkfiber08_at_gmail.com; dane.newman_at_gmail.com;
> ccielab_at_groupstudy.com
> >>>> Sent: Tue, Sep 15, 2009 3:40 pm
> >>>> Subject: Re: cisco lab safe
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Excellent question on that. The CCIE Essentials, though, is exactly
> >>>> that from them, the workbooks + videos. So I was putting out the
> >>>> option. It simply happened to be the least expensive option from us.
> >>>>
> >>>> By the way, according to
> >>>> https://cisco.hosted.jivesoftware.com/docs/DOC-5857, I was incorrect
> on
> >>>> my math. You must take ALL FOUR (4 x 349 = $1,400) AND score at least
> >>>> 80% on one of them. So their minimum investment just became $3,995 +
> >>>> $1,400 = $5,395.
> >>>>
> >>>> Slice it however you want. It's marketing, and I most certainly won't
> >>>> fault anyone for that! As always, people are capable of making their
> >>>> own decisions on things! Just do the math.
> >>>>
> >>>> I'm not downplaying the program itself. I know too many of the people
> >>>> involved and respect their capabilities all around. Not all vendors
> >>>> selling the 360 will be the same, however, which puts a kludge into
> >>>> things... but as long as you know what you're getting into, you are
> >>>> welcome to select whichever flavor of apple works best for you! Some
> >>>> may be more expensive than others despite the pretty sign next to
> them!
> >>>>
> >>>> ;)
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> *Scott Morris*, CCIE/x4/ (R&S/ISP-Dial/Security/Service Provider)
> #4713,
> >>>>
> >>>> JNCIE-M #153, JNCIS-ER, CISSP, et al.
> >>>>
> >>>> JNCI-M, JNCI-ER
> >>>>
> >>>> evil_at_ine.com
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Internetwork Expert, Inc.
> >>>>
> >>>> http://www.InternetworkExpert.com <http://www.internetworkexpert.com/
> >
> >>>>
> >>>> Toll Free: 877-224-8987
> >>>>
> >>>> Outside US: 775-826-4344
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Knowledge is power.
> >>>>
> >>>> Power corrupts.
> >>>>
> >>>> Study hard and be Eeeeviiiil......
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> armylegionmedic_at_aol.com wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I mean, maybe this is just me, but the only price that was cheap
> >>>>> enough to beat Cisco's deal was a CoD and Workkooks, so we arent
> >>>>> really comparing Apples to Apples are we? If we were to look apples
> to
> >>>>> apples or maybe like a Granny Smith vs. Mt. Washington Apple, I think
> >>>>> that the Cisco 360 offer is looking pretty tempting. The only part
> >>>>> that I would have to really say competes is the free re-sits. This is
> >>>>> all IMO, but maybe I am misreading something.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> -----Original Message-----
> >>>>> From: Dark Fiber <darkfiber08_at_gmail.com>
> >>>>> To: Scott Morris <smorris_at_ine.com>
> >>>>> Cc: Dane Newman <dane.newman_at_gmail.com>; Cisco certification
> >>>>> <ccielab_at_groupstudy.com>
> >>>>> Sent: Tue, Sep 15, 2009 3:25 pm
> >>>>> Subject: Re: cisco lab safe
> >>>>>
> >>>>> If I read that right $3500 and the price of a mock lab might be worth
> >>>>> it
> >>>>
> >>>> for
> >>>>>
> >>>>> a $1400 lab voucher if you fail. Anyone else get the same or did I
> >>>>
> >>>> misread
> >>>>>
> >>>>> it?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Scott Morris <smorris_at_ine.com>
> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Ok.... So let's do some math on this...
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> CIERS1 = $3,995
> >>>>>> CIERS2 = $4,500
> >>>>>> Essentials = $4,550
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Plus an Assessment lab (minimum 1, possibly more) = $349
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> So at a BARE MINIMUM you are looking at $3,995 + $349 = $4,345 that
> >>>>
> >>>> you
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> have to spend in order to get that.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> For INE's pricing, a bootcamp costs $2,995 (not including any
> >>>>>> discounts). The mock lab workshop is $3,995 again not counting
> >>>>>> discounts. The lab workbook set + CoD bundle = $825 + 1,695 or
> $2,520
> >>>>>> (not including any discounts). A mock lab (minimum 1, possibly
> more)
> >>>>
> >>>> =
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> $129.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> So on price point alone, you have a minimum comparable spending (not
> >>>>>> including discounts) of $2,649. That's a grand difference there of
> >>>>>> $1,696, so you can spring for another lab, not need
> pre-qualification
> >>>>>> AND save an extra $296 to use towards your
> >>>>
> >>>> airfare/hotel/food/whatever....
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Oh yeah, and you don't get re-sits in the 360 program, you can
> attend
> >>>>>> our classes as many times as you'd like to and whenever you'd like
> to.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> So I'm really thinking that this kind of promotion alone is not
> going
> >>>>
> >>>> to
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> swing someone one way or the other, at least unless they don't do
> >>>>
> >>>> math.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> But I'm sure if you work with our sales department, we would be more
> >>>>>> than happy to charge you more money and simply spring for a lab
> >>>>
> >>>> attempt
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> for you based on certain criteria and select vendors only.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> If you have any questions on this, feel free to contact me offline,
> >>>>
> >>>> I'd
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> be more than happy to cover options with you. I don't see a point
> of
> >>>>>> dragging this on and on through a technical list (e.g. non-marketing
> >>>>
> >>>> list).
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> *Scott Morris*, CCIE/x4/ (R&S/ISP-Dial/Security/Service Provider)
> >>>>
> >>>> #4713,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> JNCIE-M #153, JNCIS-ER, CISSP, et al.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> JNCI-M, JNCI-ER
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> evil_at_ine.com
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Internetwork Expert, Inc.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> http://www.InternetworkExpert.com<
> http://www.internetworkexpert.com/>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Toll Free: 877-224-8987
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Outside US: 775-826-4344
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Knowledge is power.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Power corrupts.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Study hard and be Eeeeviiiil......
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Dane Newman wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I got the following email below from cisco. All I can say is imo
> >>>>
> >>>> this
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> will
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> make it harder on 3rd party vendors sadly that do offer quality
> >>>>
> >>>> training.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> The chance to retake the lab for free is worth its weight in gold
> >>>>
> >>>> for all
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> the stress relief it can bring.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Dane
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Cisco Lab Safe Promotion: Protect Your Training Investment
> >>>>>>> Learning_at_Cisco is pleased to introduce the Cisco Lab Safe
> >>>>
> >>>> promotion. The
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Cisco Lab Safe promotion allows qualifying Cisco. 360 Learning
> >>>>
> >>>> Program
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> for
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> CCIE. Routing & Switching students who don't pass their first CCIE
> >>>>
> >>>> lab
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> exam
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> attempt, to retake the CCIE lab exam (a $1,400 US Value) at no
> >>>>
> >>>> additional
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> cost.
> >>>>>>> The Cisco 360 Learning Program for R&S guides engineers who have
> >>>>
> >>>> three to
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> five years of networking experience through an effective,
> >>>>
> >>>> job-relevant,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> proven program to build expert-level skills and to prepare for the
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> rigorous
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Cisco CCIE R&S certification exams. Together, the Cisco 360
> >>>>
> >>>> Learning
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Program for CCIE R&S and the Cisco Lab Safe promotion provide added
> >>>>>>> assurance in the quality and value of your training investment.
> >>>>>>> How the Cisco Lab Safe Promotion Works:
> >>>>>>> Students must meet the following criteria in order to be eligible
> >>>>
> >>>> for the
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Cisco Lab Safe promotion:
> >>>>>>> A recommendation from their instructor
> >>>>>>> Completed the Cisco 360 Learning Program for CCIE R&S Essentials
> >>>>
> >>>> Package
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> or
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> a CIERS instructor-led workshop
> >>>>>>> Scored 80% or better on one of the CIERS 1-4 performance
> assessments
> >>>>>>> Only select Authorized Cisco Learning Partners offer the Cisco 360
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Learning
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Program curriculum and Cisco Lab Safe promotion.
> >>>>>>> Find out more about Cisco Lab Safe promotion and the official terms
> >>>>
> >>>> and
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> conditions on the Cisco Learning Network.
> >>>>>>>
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> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Darby Weaver
> >>> Network Engineer
> >>>
> >>> 407-802-7394
> >>> darbyweaver_at_yahoo.com
> >>
> >>
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Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
Received on Tue Sep 15 2009 - 20:20:24 ART