RE: Nexus in DC?

I think it is reasonable to assume that 7K FCoE support is on its way.
But, this is the point, likely you will use the 2K/5K for server
aggregation (with FCoE), and 7K for the data center core. Do you really
want to use different vendors on your data center edge and core? (Using
2K/5K at edge for FCoE and someone in the core?)

With Cisco TrustSec, for 802.1AE support, it does require infrastructure
upgrades. But, for the security group tag support, this is enabled in
software with existing infrastructure (it's on its way). Also, TrustSec
also encompasses device authentication.

With spanning-tree, I'm not referring to multi-chassis etherchannel.
Obviously, as you mentioned vPC allows you to build networks without
spanning-tree, there are environments where spanning-tree makes sense.
With bridge assurance, it essentially adds a hello timer with BPDUs.
This allows you to detect unidirectional links within STP. Also our
Proposal and Agreement Handshakes ensures that switches agree upon the
topology. So, without those spanning-tree enhancements or vPC, you
don't have a viable way to build high availability into your data center
without threatening the stability of your design.

VDCs should really be looked at as well. VDCs virtualize the control
plane in addition to the forwarding planes (VRFs).

But, I digress. Rick, you had stated "The only thing the EX8200 lacks is
support for some sort of multi-chassis etherchannel", but the above are
examples of things, in addition to multi-chassis etherchannel, that the
EX8200 lacks. The relevance of any particular feature is certainly
dependent upon the customer environment. So, am I saying that the Nexus
is superior in every way? No. But, I am saying there is much more that
sets them apart than multi-chassis etherchannel.

Disclaimer: The above opinion is my own, and not that of my employer.

-----Original Message-----
From: nobody_at_groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody_at_groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
Rick Mur
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 9:49 PM
To: Tony Varriale
Cc: ccielab_at_groupstudy.com
Subject: Re: Nexus in DC?

Please explain, I think I don't get it ;-)

--
Regards,
Rick Mur
CCIE2 #21946 (R&S / Service Provider)
Sr. Support Engineer  IPexpert, Inc.
URL: http://www.IPexpert.com
On Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 3:22 AM, Tony Varriale
<tvarriale_at_flamboyaninc.com>wrote:
> Some people get it and some don't.  Some people never will.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
> On Aug 31, 2009, at 4:20 PM, Rick Mur <rmur_at_ipexpert.com> wrote:
>
>  Does the Nexus 7k support FCoE or fibre channel?
>> The 7k is nothing more than a big 10G switch.
>>
>> The 5k is a totally different story and I definitely see the use of 
>> that one. This is a fantastic switch, bringing 2 worlds together as 
>> it should
be,
>> reducing cabling and introducing an entire new generation of switches
>> and network designs.
>>
>> As for Cisco TrustSec, great feature, but you have to replace your 
>> entire network you use it, still it's an evolvement of network 
>> designs. I kind of miss the spanning-tree enhancements? Do you mean 
>> multi-chassis
etherchannels
>> to create a loop-free topology? This is something that is an awesome 
>> technique, this is where Juniper lacks, but it's in the pipeline.
>>
>> I personally think the Nexus product line is placed too tight, it can
>> only be used for a single purpose on one place in the network, but I 
>> still see all the advantages and I would love seeing it evolve and
become mature.
>>
>> (btw. Juniper EX4200 vs Cat 3750E, the Juniper is a lot cheaper when 
>> you use 10G uplinks in a LAN design)
>>
>> P.S. It doesn't hurt to be critical right? ;-) No offense! I always 
>> prefer Cisco, but sometimes it's good to take a step back and see all
>> from a different perspective.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Regards,
>>
>> Rick Mur
>> CCIE2 #21946 (R&S / Service Provider)
>> Sr. Support Engineer   IPexpert, Inc.
>> URL: http://www.IPexpert.com
>>
>> On 31 aug 2009, at 17:43, Mike Kraus (mikraus) wrote:
>>
>>  What about FCoE?  The Juniper EX series is good for customers 
>> wanting
>>> high performance/cost using yesterday's design, which incurs 
>>> multiple chassis (Ethernet & fibre channel), additional 
>>> cabling/power costs, and a strict top of rack or end of row design 
>>> (where reality requires both in data centers today).
>>>
>>> If you are looking at the Nexus series as a big 10G switch, you're 
>>> missing the point of the Nexus product line.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nobody_at_groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody_at_groupstudy.com] On Behalf
>>> Of Rick Mur
>>> Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 3:23 AM
>>> To: Tony Varriale
>>> Cc: ccielab_at_groupstudy.com
>>> Subject: Re: Nexus in DC?
>>>
>>> I know you can enable 'performance mode' so the linecard shuts down 
>>> 24 ports of the linecard.
>>> Why can't the EX compete to the Nexus? The performance is quite the 
>>> same if not better as the Nexus line and totally owns the Cat6500 in
>>> terms of performance. Still the Cat wins it on service modules and 
>>> the vast amount of line cards.
>>> And btw. the EX8200 already has 320Gbps backplane connection for all
>>> linecards while the Nexus gets support for 230Gbps linecards end of 
>>> the year and I don't even want to know when they start thinking of 
>>> 500Gbps to finally offer true non-blocking 32-port 10Gbps linecards 
>>> :-) The only thing the EX8200 lacks is support for some sort of 
>>> multi-chassis etherchannel, this is on the roadmap to be released
soon though.
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Rick Mur
>>> CCIE2 #21946 (R&S / Service Provider)
>>> Sr. Support Engineer   IPexpert, Inc.
>>> URL: http://www.IPexpert.com
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 3:47 AM, Tony Varriale
>>> <tvarriale_at_flamboyaninc.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>  Ok.you didn't say anything about the n7k in your message.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The n7k 10gig card can be "non-blocking".even thought that isn't 
>>>> the correct terminology.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Also, the v2 cards are coming out next year which will address the 
>>>> 10g
>>>>
>>>
>>>  card oversub issue.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The EX series doesn't really compete with the Nexus line.  It's 
>>>> more of a competitor to the 6500s/ME6500s.  When the new Cisco Sup 
>>>> comes out it will match the 10gig per slot capabilities.  The EX is
>>>> more of just straight 10GE enterprise or SP.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> tv
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> From: Rick Mur [mailto:rmur_at_ipexpert.com]
>>>> Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 5:46 PM
>>>> To: Tony Varriale
>>>> Cc: ccielab_at_groupstudy.com
>>>> Subject: Re: Nexus in DC?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The Nexus 7k. Of the 32-port 10GE linecard, you can only use 8 
>>>> specifically marked ports if you want the full non-blocking 10GE 
>>>> due to the backplane connection. End 2009 they will release a 
>>>> linecard with 230Gbps backplane connection, so that should give a 
>>>> little better
>>>>
>>> port-density vs.
>>>
>>>> performance. Also the Cat6500 is oversubscribed as it also has a 
>>>> 40Gbps backplane connection and you can buy 8-port 10GE linecards 
>>>> and 48-port 1GE ones.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> So I really like the non-blocking idea of the Juniper EX8200, great
>>>> selling point :-)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>> Rick Mur
>>>> CCIE2 #21946 (R&S / Service Provider) Sr. Support Engineer - 
>>>> IPexpert, Inc.
>>>> URL: http://www.IPexpert.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:34 AM, Tony Varriale < 
>>>> tvarriale_at_flamboyaninc.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Which Cisco product are you referring to that is oversubbed?
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Aug 30, 2009, at 5:09 PM, Rick Mur <rmur_at_ipexpert.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I will be installing the first UCS chassis' in the Netherlands 
>>>> within the next month, of course with the UCS6k (Tweaked Nexus 5k).
>>>> I also implemented one of the first Nexus 5k's in NL last March :-)
>>>> So yes cool stuff! Still needs some time to get mature in terms of 
>>>> hardware and software.
>>>> Juniper actually has a better DC switch with their EX8200 (totally 
>>>> non-blocking), much cheaper for the same amount of bandwidth (not 
>>>> port
>>>>
>>>
>>>  density, but the Juniper is NOT oversubscribed).
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>> Rick Mur
>>>> CCIE2 #21946 (R&S / Service Provider)
>>>> Sr. Support Engineer   IPexpert, Inc.
>>>> URL: http://www.IPexpert.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 9:07 PM, Ronald Johns <rj686b_at_att.com>
wrote:
>>>>
>>>> We're doing Nexus as well.  In fact, we're likely ordering 
>>>> everything tomorrow.  Keep in mind, there's a limit to 12 FEX's to 
>>>> a 5000 cluster, or at least that's what they tell me.  They screwed
>>>> up our first quote because our SE didn't look into this...
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: nobody_at_groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody_at_groupstudy.com] On 
>>>> Behalf Of Omkar Tambalkar
>>>> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 5:12 PM
>>>> To: Cisco certification
>>>> Subject: Re: Nexus in DC?
>>>>
>>>> We are also rolling out the NX 7010 and 5020 in the next couple of 
>>>> months as part of our datacenter network upgrade. I am planning to 
>>>> use
>>>>
>>>
>>>  vPCs from the 5020 to 7010 but as we are using 2 VDCs there will be
>>>> vPC for each VDC translating to 4 10g coming out of each 5020. I am
>>>> sure we will have to get a extra 32 port 10g card with 8 ports 
>>>> dedicated for line speed for these cross connects. Not to mention 
>>>> you need 1 keep-alive and 1 cross-connect for each VDC.
>>>> It seems that the 7010 can do lot of service aggregation using the 
>>>> ACE, WAAS modules but we just want to consolidate our aggregation 
>>>> switches in to single set of chasiss.
>>>> On top of that in a few months time, we have provide active-active 
>>>> datacenter functionality with a set of NX 7010 at each datacenter 
>>>> so that traffic can be load balanced.
>>>> And the training was a 4-day Firefly course...which was fairly 
>>>> basic in terms of depth and breadth of material covered Fun
times.......
>>>>
>>>> -Omkar Tambalkar
>>>> CCIE #24892
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 7:23 AM, Tony Varriale
>>>> <tvarriale_at_flamboyaninc.com>wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Yup.
>>>>
>>>> If this is your first experience with any of those platforms I 
>>>> guarantee you are going to run into something not so pleasant.
>>>>
>>>> tv
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: nobody_at_groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody_at_groupstudy.com] On 
>>>> Behalf Of Marc La Porte
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 3:27 AM
>>>> To: Cisco certification
>>>> Subject: Nexus in DC?
>>>>
>>>> Hey guys,
>>>>
>>>> Any of you already having practical experience with big Nexus 
>>>> roll-outs
>>>>
>>>> in
>>>>
>>>> Data Centers? Running into any "problems"?
>>>>
>>>> For a customer we are planning to deploy 5020 end-of-row switches 
>>>> with
>>>>
>>>
>>>  2148T top-of-rack switches, aggregated in 7018s fully loaded with
>>>> 32-port
>>>>
>>>> 10-Gbps
>>>>
>>>> blades. Just to give you an idea, the complete data center would be
>>>>
>>>> around
>>>>
>>>> 256 rows (30,000 ports)...
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Marc
>>>>
>>>>
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