Re: The State of the CCIE Training Industry

No R&S rack should cost more than $450 per month.

On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 12:44 PM, Gary Duncanson <
gary.duncanson_at_googlemail.com> wrote:

> Some of us regular guys always pay list price for rack rental and workbooks
> regardless of the options available. It adds up to thousands of dollars. But
> I guess some of us are old fashioned like that :)
>
> Lots of chatter about all this sort of thing on the list of late. I don't
> pretend to understand what it's all about but I hope it all gets
> straightened out. I tanked on anymore labprep tonight. Really busy day at
> work today.
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Persio Pucci" <persio_at_gmail.com>
> To: "Cisco certification" <ccielab_at_groupstudy.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 2009 7:49 PM
>
> Subject: Re: The State of the CCIE Training Industry
>
>
> You know what? You have a good point there... I also think that the
>> "pirate"
>> would not buy it anyway... but would a regular guy buy it if he had access
>> to the "pirated" material? What if it costed $1000? And how about $100? Or
>> even $10 as Darby mentioned... Maybe the problem is the price point?
>> idk...
>>
>> As for choosing INE, it was down to cost (yes, our pocket does have a
>> bottom
>> too!!!)... and besides I tried to find out about IPexpert material (which
>> had almost the same price) but did not hear back from them, so I chose
>> INE.
>> Their approach is not my personal favorite, but they were responsive on my
>> inquiry... (guess everybody else was out on Networkers Live?)
>>
>> On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 3:23 PM, Luan Nguyen <luan_at_netcraftsmen.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>> IMHO, choosing INE for SP only when you have a good understanding of the
>>> blueprint. For starter, IEMentor, CCbootcamp, and IPExpert are probably
>>> much better. I like the proctor guide from IPExpert for
>>> security...explain
>>> stuff to you. But that's just me, other people from my company like
>>> INE...now that Scott is there, we probably could get good discount? :)
>>> You guys have almost 10K every year...you can do more for the training
>>> community:) take a bootcamp, buy something more expensive :) tell your
>>> coworkers...since you seem to be under a nice boss.
>>> Piracy is not that bad...for guys like you, you don't need to pirate
>>> anything. For people who pirate stuff, they wouldn't buy them anyhow so
>>> trainers don't lose much there.
>>>
>>> Luan Nguyen
>>> Chesapeake NetCraftsmen, LLC.
>>> http://www3.netcraftsmen.net
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nobody_at_groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody_at_groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
>>> Persio Pucci
>>> Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 2009 1:27 PM
>>> To: Cisco certification
>>> Subject: Re: The State of the CCIE Training Industry
>>>
>>> Brian,
>>>
>>> please keep INE alive, I just recently bought the SP material and I'd
>>> love
>>> to see that updated a little... :)
>>>
>>> While saying that, I think the training vendors should ALSO invest (more)
>>> on
>>> the other tracks... if you are just a newcomer you might think it's R&S
>>> or
>>> nothing. I know Cisco's next blow is the Voice 360... but hey, there are
>>> other tracks too... why not give them a little (more) attention?
>>> *(And just for the record, I (well, the company) bought the R&S material
>>> as
>>> well in the past... 5 printed and 3 eletronics sets if I am not mistaken.
>>> I'm doing my part helping you guys :D)*
>>> I agree with Darby, however, that piracy is the damnation of any training
>>> material (not Cisco-exclusive). Cannot think of a way out of it,
>>> however...
>>> :(
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jul 14, 2009 at 1:11 AM, Brian Dennis <
>>> bdennis_at_internetworkexpert.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> > As an FYI I'm not dead as rumored in the previous email ;-)
>>> >
>>> > I'll post an update to our blog tonight or tomorrow letting people know
>>> > what's going on at INE since a few people seem to be making up some >
>>> crazy
>>> > off the wall rumors. Basically we're just starting the process of
>>> opening
>>> > up additional operations in the Seattle, WA area where I now currently
>>> > live. Although Reno, NV is a nice place the amount of high tech >
>>> workers
>>> > is very limited to say the least. This wasn't a problem when we were
>>> > smaller but now we can't continue to grow with the limited high tech
>>> > workforce in the Reno area.
>>> >
>>> > In order to continue to grow we need to have offices in an area that >
>>> has
>>> a
>>> > good technical workforce to select from. Just trying to find a good
>>> > full-time PHP web developer or CCNA in Reno is a real struggle. This >
>>> of
>>> > course isn't the case in the Seattle area. Additionally flights to the
>>> > Seattle area for students attending classes are far better than the
>>> > limited selection of flights to the Reno area. Also the selection of
>>> > hotels for students is far better here in Seattle over Reno.
>>> >
>>> > Brian Dennis, CCIEx5 #2210 (R&S/ISP-Dial/Security/SP/Voice)
>>> > bdennis_at_internetworkexpert.com
>>> >
>>> > Internetwork Expert, Inc.
>>> > http://www.InternetworkExpert.com<http://www.internetworkexpert.com/><
>>> http://www.internetworkexpert.com/><
>>> http://www.internetworkexpert.com/>
>>> > Toll Free: 877-224-8987 x 703
>>> > Outside US: 775-826-4344 x 703
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > ----- Original Message -----
>>> > From: "Anthony Faria" <tfaria72_at_gmail.com>
>>> > Sent: Sun, July 12, 2009 21:01
>>> > Subject:Re: The State of the CCIE Training Industry
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Were the blog hits low this week Darby ? LOL Really bro if you spent >
>>> as
>>> > much
>>> > time writing as you did studying you would be done with multiple ccie.
>>> > I
>>> > think you are a skilled wirter I think you should apply at a e IT
>>> magazine
>>> > or something. Not trying to slam you bro but sometimes you are over the
>>> > top.
>>> > Things change and so do companies it is a fact of life. The stuff you
>>> > originally bought was probably two lab versions ago. So if 5 years >
>>> later
>>> > the
>>> > company goes under well shit you got your money worth. So please keep
>>> your
>>> > posts to your blog on this stuff . If you are going to help and answer
>>> > questions step up do some good instead of being war time media >
>>> coverage.
>>> I
>>> > seen Waynes alien Baby damn he is ugly!!! He sounded like Scott from >
>>> the
>>> > audio series though LOL JK Scott.
>>> >
>>> > Tony
>>> >
>>> > On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 11:05 AM, Darby Weaver <ccie.weaver_at_gmail.com
>>> > >wrote:
>>> >
>>> > > Hey don't take it quite so personal. Well I'd better take a step > >
>>> back
>>> on
>>> > > that one as you are currently working for one of the companies that
>>> other
>>> > > companies are talking about lately.
>>> > >
>>> > > What I saw at the conference was a certain sense of fear of what is
>>> > > happening and there is a lot of fallout from that fear and > >
>>> uncertainty.
>>> > >
>>> > > Some said InternetworkExpert is going through some rough times and >
>>> > the
>>> > only
>>> > > two viable major companies left were: The Cisco CCIE 360 Consortium
>>> and
>>> > > IPExpert.
>>> > >
>>> > > Narbik joined the 360 it seems.
>>> > >
>>> > > InternetworkExpert may be perceived as having loss a certain sense of
>>> > > direction - I'm just summarizing here - The question that was used >
>>> > for
>>> a
>>> > > basis is "What's happening with Brian Dennis and the CCIE 2.0
>>> Program?".
>>> > >
>>> > > Don't take it that badly - I just gave you insight into what your
>>> > > competition is thinking and you should consider my words carefully.
>>> > >
>>> > > It was that line of reasoning that got me worried a bit last night.
>>> > >
>>> > > Technically IE has the killer product - The PolyLabs and they are > >
>>> quite
>>> > > innovative, creative, and quite possibly the single most act of > >
>>> genius
>>> > > created in a while. Simple plan and very nice exectution.
>>> > >
>>> > > IPExpert is expanding its borders.
>>> > >
>>> > > Cisco CCIE 360 is doing the same (kinda reminds me of pirates on the
>>> high
>>> > > seas but hey it I'd hope someone is making money from it - ). Hah!
>>> Hey
>>> > > they had to get the instructors from somewhere.
>>> > >
>>> > > I'm kinda wondering when Scott Morris is going to go independent
>>> > actually.
>>> > > You of all people have the name, reputation, sincerity, and technical
>>> > > expertise to pull it off. And you get back to people and everyone
>>> know
>>> > > it.
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > I recall one instuctor saying he earned in 5 weeks at one point what
>>> took
>>> > > him almost a whole year to earn working for an employer. And of > >
>>> course
>>> > he
>>> > > is a very passionate instructor too.
>>> > >
>>> > > I kind of see one side trying to pick up all the chips or cash in the
>>> > chips
>>> > > that don't play the game.
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > The piracy thing is the single biggest attack on the CCIE program and
>>> it
>>> > is
>>> > > a hard one to beat. Companies want to sell en masse and as long as
>>> that
>>> > is
>>> > > working - great. However, we have a very limited market and only so
>>> many
>>> > > candiates at a given time.
>>> > >
>>> > > I'm trying to say the Troubleshooting Section if delivered in classes
>>> and
>>> > > in
>>> > > classes alone, then it may help turn this thing around. But it won't
>>> > work
>>> > > if all companies and individuals don't come together to nip it in the
>>> > bud.
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > Hey just an opinion.
>>> > >
>>> > > If trainers are selling 10,000 copies electroinically instead of say
>>> > > 10
>>> > or
>>> > > even 100, then by all means carry on.
>>> > >
>>> > > If you ain't selling enough copies to justify the production costs >
>>> > (as
>>> > has
>>> > > been said to me privately), then you might want to take my observance
>>> > into
>>> > > account.
>>> > >
>>> > > Of course copy machines abound - but the real output ought to be in >
>>> > the
>>> > > class room itself and presentation.
>>> > >
>>> > > Scott you are quite legendary at this and you of all people would be
>>> > > a
>>> > > person to profit from such a situation.
>>> > >
>>> > > Time are changing. Sorry to kick things back to the stone ages, but
>>> > > security is not quite so secure on intellectual property these days.
>>> > > Handle
>>> > > with care.
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 1:22 PM, Scott Morris <smorris_at_ine.com> > >
>>> wrote:
>>> > >
>>> > > > So your shock and awe about two companies left in the end was meant
>>> to
>>> > > > educate everyone that people stealing the digital downloads is bad?
>>> > > that's
>>> > > > a very strange way of delivering that message.
>>> > > >
>>> > > > And no, I haven't read your wiki. Didn't know you had one because
>>> > > > I
>>> > > > haven't really had the need to Google you and find out what things
>>> were
>>> > > or
>>> > > > were not posted by/about you.
>>> > > >
>>> > > > Next thing you know you're going to go with all-out > > >
>>> exclusive-photos
>>> of
>>> > > > Wayne Lawson's Alien Baby. And I just really don't think that's
>>> > > necessary.
>>> > > > That's a private family matter.
>>> > > >
>>> > > > ;)
>>> > > >
>>> > > >
>>> > > >
>>> > > >
>>> > > > *Scott Morris*, CCIE*x4* (R&amp;amp;S/ISP-Dial/Security/Service
>>> > Provider)
>>> > #4713,
>>> > > >
>>> > > > JNCIE-M #153, JNCIS-ER, CISSP, et al.
>>> > > >
>>> > > > JNCI-M, JNCI-ER
>>> > > >
>>> > > > evil_at_ine.com
>>> > > >
>>> > > >
>>> > > > Internetwork Expert, Inc.
>>> > > >
>>> > > > http://www.InternetworkExpert.com<http://www.internetworkexpert.com/>
>>> <http://www.internetworkexpert.com/>
>>> <http://www.internetworkexpert.com/><
>>> > http://www.internetworkexpert.com/>
>>> > > >
>>> > > > Toll Free: 877-224-8987
>>> > > >
>>> > > > Outside US: 775-826-4344
>>> > > >
>>> > > >
>>> > > > Knowledge is power.
>>> > > >
>>> > > > Power corrupts.
>>> > > >
>>> > > > Study hard and be Eeeeviiiil......
>>> > > >
>>> > > >
>>> > > >
>>> > > > Darby Weaver wrote:
>>> > > >
>>> > > > FYI -
>>> > > >
>>> > > > I'm not so much concerned with Brian Dennis and whether or not he's
>>> > still
>>> > > > with IE, I would hope he is, but if he's not I do not see such a
>>> > talented
>>> > > > individual being without options.
>>> > > >
>>> > > > I'm not so much as concerned about my nose and whether or not it is
>>> > > broken
>>> > > > or not. (I guess someone never read my Wiki).
>>> > > >
>>> > > > I am concerned about my general investment in the CCIE Program. > >
>>> > That
>>> > is
>>> > > the
>>> > > > point of the matter.
>>> > > >
>>> > > >
>>> > > > I am concerned when I see CCIE Instructors and Content Developers
>>> > > speaking
>>> > > > of no longer being able to make a living at their expectations in
>>> this
>>> > > > industry. This concerns me and if you have invested money in some
>>> > > > of
>>> > > these
>>> > > > programs and have a vested interest then it may or may not concern
>>> you.
>>> > > >
>>> > > > The tabloid thing catches the eye - but the real matter is that > >
>>> > with
>>> > the
>>> > > > advent of technology - people are taking advantage of the ease of
>>> > > downloads
>>> > > > and literally bankrupting an otherwise thriving industry.
>>> > > >
>>> > > >
>>> > > > Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>> > > >
>>> > > >
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>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > ----- End of original message -----
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > ----- End of original message -----
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>>
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>
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> _______________________________________________________________________
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>

-- 
Narbik Kocharians
CCSI#30832, CCIE# 12410 (R&S, SP, Security)
www.MicronicsTraining.com
Sr. Technical Instructor
Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net