RE: Core Knowledge - Don't mis-interpret this

Trivia is a matter of perspective. We've seen a lot of different takes on
this, and like most things, many different opinions. Those who've already
passed, the simple response is "you should know it". Which of course,
everyone else hates! :)

Now... Perspective. If you know whatever "it" is, then it's not trivia,
it's knowledge. If you don't, it's likely trivia. Let me give you an
example. I do not run EIGRP in production networks for any of my clients.
Yet, on the written exams, >I< think there's way too many EIGRP questions.
I find them very irritating and very trivial. I generally grumble and
complain for a day or two around my recert time, yet, in the end... I still
have to know the material in order to pass the exam and get my recert.

Other people may use a lot of EIGRP, and they look at that exam and think
it's awesome. Because they are being asked easy questions! it's simply a
matter of perspective.

The questions don't change.

In the end, well, it means you have to know BOTH the theory, application AND
the configuration techniques of each of these protocols. While you are
working on it, it may seem like it sucks. In the end, it will make you a
better engineer (which is what I think the true goal is) and therefore
should prove to be 21 EASY points!

I'm not sure how we've established any sense of "inconsistent" or "unfairly
graded" status though, so I'm interested in hearing details on that. But
there are certainly many people complaining and many people saying it was
easy.

But the perspective is that candidates today should know both the theory and
the configuration of each of the tchnologies on the blueprint.

HTH,

Scott

-----Original Message-----
From: nobody_at_groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody_at_groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of Josh
Fleishman
Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 10:37 PM
To: Darby Weaver
Cc: Larry; Narbik Kocharians; ccielab_at_groupstudy.com
Subject: Re: Core Knowledge - Don't mis-interpret this

Trivia implies 'Trivial', and I think that's the point. Yes, CCIEs have had
to know this stuff before now, but they didn't have to memorize what a lot
of us are calling trivia.

What I think we're experiencing now is the beginning of backlash against a
failed beta program. Cisco beta tested the questions used in the CK section
before putting them into 'production'. Now we have a situation where
qualified candidates are providing QA for these questions, at their cost,
time, effort and emotional investment. The feedback from those who have
failed at the hands of the CK section is that these questions or
inconsistent, unfairly graded, and weighted far too heavily. As in any
situation when a production release proves faulty, there are typically two
options: 1) The production release can be recalled, an apology issued, and
alternative solutions are pursued, or 2) The production release can be
adjusted in the wild, quietly, until the kinks are worked out. The first
option is what a lof of folks are hoping for, but I think we'll end up
seeing something closer to the second option. Unfortunately, in the
meantime some qualified candidates are going to fail, and complain
(rightfully so), and possibly even give-up their pursuit. Eventually Cisco
will refine these questions, removing those causing conflict and life goes
on.

I have some concerns about what this 'revised' CCIE really means. It feels
like it's significantly diminished from what it had been up until recently.
At 79 points for the lab, it's implied that the CK section is worth 21
points since you have to score an 80 overall to pass, and you cannot pass if
you fail the CK section. So, 21% of a passing CCIE score is based off of
one's ability to correctly answer 3 non-ccie level questions (often referred
to as "easy" by those who pass). Accordingly, the lab portion of the exam
has been reduced from 100 points to 79 points. Presumably the lab section
is going to be easier now by either having less 3-4pt questions, covering
less topics, or having fewer tasks per topic. The meaning of having a CCIE
number greater than 24000 could be considered to be less significant than
those possessing numbers less than 24000. In other words, the CCIE exam may
be just as difficult to pass overall, but the definition of what qualifies
you to be an 'expert' has changed substantially.

In case it's not obvious, I'm not pleased with this development and I hope
everyone else who isn't pleased is voicing their concerns to Cisco as well.
It might even make a difference.

-Josh

On Fri, Apr 17, 2009 at 4:43 PM, Darby Weaver <ccie.weaver_at_gmail.com> wrote:

> Hey,
>
> Let's face it a lot of people took short cuts to qualify for the lab
> portion
> of the exam.
>
> Now that we are all over that one.
>
> A lot of people take short cuts to pass the lab or maybe people just use
> "gunmen" to take the lab for them? Who knows...?
>
> But Cisco must be more right than wrong given the number of people who are
> freaking out and blaming the open-ended questions on their failure.
>
> In any event, all of us who still want to be CCIE's now have to keep up
> with
> the trivia...
>
> 1. Command Config Guides
>
> 2. Command References
>
> 3. Technotes and FAQ's
>
> 4. Networkers Techtorials, Slides, and other Prep Materials...
>
> 5. Oh yes... RFC's too.
>
>
> Are you telling me that so many of the CCIE's before never had to know
this
> stuff?
>
>
> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>
> _______________________________________________________________________
> Subscription information may be found at:
> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html

Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
Received on Sun Apr 19 2009 - 14:02:26 ART