Re: To All

"Now if you get a guy who passed the lab on the first attempt... He should
be walking on water too at least where lab criteria are concerned."

Why is that? I can't speak for everyone but in my case I had well
over 10 years of experience under my belt before attempting the lab.
I failed the written exam twice and then went on to pass it twice
before I even attempted the lab. I spent countless hours working
through practice labs. I took 3 NMC CheckIT labs and scored 80+ on
each of them. THEN I attempted the lab for the first time.

Is it possible that some people are smart enough to wait until they
know that they're ready before attempting the lab for the 1st, 2nd,
3rd, 4th, 5th, etc. time? In my case it came out of my pocket so I
made damn well sure that I was ready. Even with all of that
preparation and confidence I nearly failed. I finished with just
enough time to check everything and caught a big mistake. It takes a
bit of luck too IMHO. I passed 1st try but I don't know everything.
I make mistakes and I don't "walk on water."

Now I'm sure that there are some 1st time passers that take the easy
road, and that pisses me off. I didn't see my infant son grow up for
the better part of the first 6 months of his life while I worked on
practice labs, read the doc cd, took mock labs, etc. I made
sacrifices because I wanted it that bad. I'm tired of reading your
little comments about how 1st time passers had to have cheated or
received "help." I received no more help from anyone than you
received in any of the bootcamps you attended and I 100% earned it.

Ronnie

On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 11:56 AM, Darby Weaver <ccie.weaver_at_gmail.com> wrote:
> Actually Persio has a point.
>
> The goal of the certification programs has been met. People know the
> products and they know the vendors.
>
> Merely studying to pass a test is really a mute point. Especially when so
> many others don't even try to study.
>
> How many others? Well Sadikhov.com has over 150,000 registered members and
> anywhere from 1000 -over 9000+ guests visited the site every single 15
> minutes.
>
> That pretty is a testimory that the certifications are probably past their
> shelf life.
>
> Even the CCIE program with the OEQ has already been tainted.
>
> But what chance did it have really? How many people out there don't even
> consider "CHEATING" to be "CHEATING"...
>
> They really just want to make sure they pass the first time - whether they
> learn or not is of little consequence.
>
> Hmmm...
>
> Let me say that again:
>
> They only want a passing score, even if it means all they had to do was
> memorize their 123's and ABC's - meaning Q1 was A and Q2 was C and Q3 was
> B.... etc.
>
> Hell - You have to understand that they had evolved beyond merely passing
> the test... (I mean no self-respecting Sadikhovian ever wanted to report
> less than a 1000/1000 score report)...
>
> Now they needed the sample resumes - to cheat from...
>
> And interview questions to prepare from...
>
> And...
>
> What do you think comes next?
>
> So... this all stops if people wake up and see what happened to the poor
> ill-protected and often dis-respected Certfication Programs.
>
>
> I'd recommend interviewers ask the job candidate for their score report as a
> part of the interview process and conduct the interview based on the score.
> If you get a guy who can amazingly score 1000/1000 then that person should
> be amazingly sharp.
>
> Hah!
>
> Now if you get a guy who passed the lab on the first attempt... He should
> be walking on water too at least where lab criteria are concerned.
>
> It is true I see non-certified people every day holding their own quite
> well.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 9:18 AM, Persio Pucci <persio_at_gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Want something better? We should definitely let go of certifications
>> already... instead of studying to pass a test, go actually learn stuff and
>> use it.
>> I know a lot of people that just don't care about certs, and they are as
>> good as us and are as recognized as us, not for their badges but for their
>> work.
>>
>> Just my 2c...
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 10:06 AM, Ahsan Mohiuddin <
>> ahsan.mohiuddin_at_gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Darby, it seems to me a waste of time and energy.. the ship's going down;
>>> and we are all going down with it *sigh*. For all we know cisco high-ups
>>> might be enjoying this heated debate of ours, since we NEVER get their
>>> official word even when all hell breaks loose. i guess cisco management is
>>> too g*ddam 'distributed' to come up with any swift/useful/decisive action
>>> regarding their formerly "industry-leading, A-class" certification
>>> program.
>>> Sir John, hi there, can you hear us Sir.. please? we really need your
>>> help.
>>> Somebody please grab his attention
>>>
>>> Lets do Juniper or Foundry or Riverbed certs and hope that by the the time
>>> the braindumpers can catch up, we will be sitting pretty in the high-up
>>> management roles, and the 'mere technicalities' will no longer be an
>>> issue... anybody think that a good idea? or is that just plain bs coming
>>> out
>>> of my overstressed, understimulated brain?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 5:56 PM, Darby Weaver <ccie.weaver_at_gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> > Guys - IT IS NOT AN APRIL FOOL'S JOKE!
>>> >
>>> > NO IT IS NOT.
>>> >
>>> > It was there long before April and one of the guys from Sadikhov pointed
>>> it
>>> > out to me after I started cleaning Sadikhov.com of every post that hints
>>> of
>>> > mentioning P4S, TK, or the like. There are older posts but there are not
>>> > any
>>> > newer posts and if there are they are deleted on sight and the members
>>> > posting the questions are banned for 7 days - those posting anything
>>> that
>>> > breaks copyright get banned for 1 month to 12 months - effectively
>>> removing
>>> > their ability to post any longer at all.
>>> >
>>> > Trust me this is no joke.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 6:23 AM, Pavel Bykov <slidersv_at_gmail.com> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > > It looks like fake from the name.
>>> > > His name is Gay... a bit self explanatory. And if you count in all the
>>> > > Berries, then the intent of the author seems obvious.
>>> > > Reported it non the less... this was really a downer.
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 11:56 AM, Nick <ccieaz_at_googlemail.com> wrote:
>>> > >
>>> > >> shocking, i cant believe it.
>>> > >>
>>> > >> On a side not, there is no Cisco employee called "Gay Berryman", or
>>> even
>>> > >> with the second name "Berryman". So i think its a April fool or some
>>> > kind
>>> > >> of fake.
>>> > >>
>>> > >> Nick
>>> > >>
>>> > >> 2009/4/2 Darby Weaver <ccie.weaver_at_gmail.com>
>>> > >>
>>> > >> > BTW - Here is a prime example of the mentality of the faithful
>>> Brain
>>> > >> > Dumper
>>> > >> > community that is thoroughly enraged at not having access to the
>>> > latest
>>> > >> > dumps, CBTS, and other copyrighted materials at his fingertips:
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> > [QUOTE (neo_adi @ Mar 21 2009, 05:35 PM)] [image:
>>> > >> > *]<http://www.sadikhov.com/forum/index.php?act=findpost&pid=823528
>>> >
>>> > >> > I'm sure that braindumps weren't the only things shared in the
>>> OFFERs
>>> > >> and
>>> > >> > request section..
>>> > >> > Some really good CBTs and ebooks were shared.. hope the admins do
>>> look
>>> > >> at
>>> > >> > it
>>> > >> > and see to it that some arrangement is made to get back those posts
>>> on
>>> > >> > those
>>> > >> > really wonderful CBT's and ebooks, study notes avaialable here...
>>> > >> > [End of Quote]
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> > [Quote]
>>> > >> > yes this is the main reason why Sadikov was my first stop when new
>>> > cbts
>>> > >> > from
>>> > >> > cbtnuggets or trainsignal I even was apart of a few group buys here
>>> > >> which
>>> > >> > built some cool online tech friendships
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> > For the guy who said maybe this will give us true techs a chance at
>>> > jobs
>>> > >> > you
>>> > >> > are a FAKE SIR!!! Any real tech knows right now the I.T field exp
>>> > >> anything
>>> > >> > with CISCO , sharepoint , exc hange and server 2008 puts you at the
>>> > top
>>> > >> of
>>> > >> > the list for jobs.
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> > Get this braindump mentality out of your heads now its bad
>>> > information.
>>> > >> The
>>> > >> > only way a braindump is bad is if you put no effort into studying
>>> try
>>> > to
>>> > >> > buy
>>> > >> > 1 and then memorize those answers
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> > The correct way to use a brain dump and how we do it at the
>>> pentagon
>>> > and
>>> > >> > GOV
>>> > >> > level
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> > 1) Pick a course
>>> > >> > 2) Get the official book and try to find a cbt which relates to the
>>> > >> subject
>>> > >> > 3) Cbts usually in the begin give you ideas on what lab to build ,
>>> as
>>> > >> you
>>> > >> > are reading try to simulate and do the same things the author or
>>> cbt
>>> > >> > teacher
>>> > >> > is doing mostly getting used to areas in a program or command line
>>> > >> > 4) Finish the book and cbt << You have now earned your right to
>>> seek
>>> > >> > answers
>>> > >> > from any source possible now
>>> > >> > 5) If having issues with wondering how they are going to attack you
>>> on
>>> > a
>>> > >> > test get a practice test or pass4sure
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> > For those who go straight to step 5 without doing the other get
>>> ready
>>> > to
>>> > >> > have a employer laugh you at of his office during the interview
>>> > because
>>> > >> you
>>> > >> > will show right then and there you have no idea about the subject .
>>> > Most
>>> > >> > employers will only want to know do you know anything about this
>>> > >> question
>>> > >> > topic and whats the main area or tool you will use to troubleshoot
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> > [End of Quote]
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> > You see you'd have thought the Admin over at Sadikhov and guys like
>>> me
>>> > >> > killed their favorite dog or something.
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> > No people, in case you are a little slow, P4S and others are NOT
>>> > >> legitimate
>>> > >> > study aids.
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> > Go to certguard.com and check their lists. They'll help you see
>>> the
>>> > >> > light.
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> > Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>> > >> >
>>> > >> >
>>> > _______________________________________________________________________
>>> > >> > Subscription information may be found at:
>>> > >> > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>>> > >>
>>> > >>
>>> > >> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>> > >>
>>> > >>
>>> _______________________________________________________________________
>>> > >> Subscription information may be found at:
>>> > >> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>>> > >>
>>> > >>
>>> > >>
>>> > >>
>>> > >>
>>> > >>
>>> > >>
>>> > >>
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > --
>>> > > Pavel Bykov
>>> > > ----------------
>>> > > Don't forget to help stopping the braindumps, use of which reduces
>>> value
>>> > of
>>> > > your certifications. Sign the petition at
>>> http://www.stopbraindumps.com/
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>> >
>>> > _______________________________________________________________________
>>> > Subscription information may be found at:
>>> > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>>>
>>>
>>> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________________________________
>>> Subscription information may be found at:
>>> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>
>
> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>
> _______________________________________________________________________
> Subscription information may be found at:
> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>
>
>
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>

-- 
Ronald Angello
CCIE 17846
CCDP, CCIP, CCNP
Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net