Re: Frame-relay Fragmentation!

From: Narbik Kocharians (narbikk@gmail.com)
Date: Tue Jan 13 2009 - 22:28:48 ARST

I write my own labs.

On Tue, Jan 13, 2009 at 4:17 PM, Darby Weaver <ccie.weaver@gmail.com> wrote:

> Honestly though the only person who I've seen as a trainer who any stats
> and conclusions can be drawn from is that guy from Germany.
>
> He literally has smiling faces with CCIE Digits tacked onto them.
>
> If you count them and do the math for his 3-week classes he is about the
> closest person I can think of who has even close to perfect average.
>
> Now the flip side:
>
> 1. Student who I did the mock labs with left his class and passed the lab
> with another week's usage of the instructor's racks per the deal.
>
> 2. One other student just emailed me and is going back to visit Mr. H. for
> the 3rd time - 3 weeks each and his company is paying for the training so I
> guess he can go till he passes. I don't think this is normal though. But I
> think my friend is a manager a client-company too.
>
> It all depends on the student too.
>
> Then again:
>
> Some people I know reported back they did not think much of his teaching
> style and a 1-2 of them trained with Narbik and loved him by comparison.
> Note: the guy who passed above also trained with Narbik and had good things
> to say but I think he said he wished the classes were longer in duration at
> Narbik's as I recall. If I recall correctly he may have been to one or more
> othe trainers too.
>
> The truth is a lot of candidates use more than one workbook or trainer.
>
> And there is the case where some of the vendors have even used the same
> people to write some of their materials - well how many people are there who
> want to write labs all day anyway? One side does not advertise who's
> writing their labs since ghost writers don't get to get the credit for their
> work and the ghost writers want to work more and so solicit themselves to
> other vendors as well.
>
> So things get a little murky.
>
> Who's writing for who? Who's being true? And Who don't even write
> anymore?
>
> And then when one vendor suspects or knows for sure about a promiscuous lab
> workbook writer... Hmm.... Things happen too it seems.
>
> And we live in such a small world for such stuff.
>
>
> Funny how the ball rolls.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 1/13/09, Scott Morris <swm@emanon.com> wrote:
>>
>> :)
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
>> Narbik Kocharians
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2009 4:45 PM
>> To: Darby Weaver
>> Cc: Tyson Scott; Pavel Bykov; Hobbs; mike jones; ccielab@groupstudy.com
>> Subject: Re: Frame-relay Fragmentation!
>>
>> hahahaha
>>
>> I should have said 72.4 percent passing on thier first attempt. I guess
>> its
>> like the 500 pages of QOS.
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 13, 2009 at 6:20 AM, Darby Weaver <ccie.weaver@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Actually,
>> >
>> > If you really wanna know how the "words" might look you got a few
>> options:
>> >
>> > 1. Check CCO for the Tech Tips where the issues affected someone and how
>> > Cisco had to deal with it -
>> >
>>
>> http://www.cisco.com/en/US/tech/tk1077/technologies_tech_note09186a00801142d
>> e.shtml
>> >
>> > 2. The CCIE Accessor.
>> >
>> > 3. Cisco Press CCIE Lab Books and Practical Studies Books.
>> >
>> > 4. Cisco Press - Frame Relay
>> >
>> > Maybe it's time to post the list of books you can use in lieu of a class
>> > for those on a tight budget or who don't have corporate funding.
>> >
>> >
>> > Verify on both sides of the link:
>> >
>> > R5#sh frame-relay fragment interface s1/0 501
>> >
>> > fragment size 200 fragment type end-to-end
>> > in fragmented pkts 4511 out fragmented pkts 86
>> > in fragmented bytes 109183 out fragmented bytes 10797
>> > in un-fragmented pkts 162 out un-fragmented pkts 88
>> > in un-fragmented bytes 10808 out un-fragmented bytes 5952
>> > in assembled pkts 1053 out pre-fragmented pkts 130
>> > in assembled bytes 94707 out pre-fragmented bytes 16317
>> > in dropped reassembling pkts 0 out dropped fragmenting pkts
>> > 0
>> > in DE fragmented pkts 4511 out DE fragmented pkts 0
>> > in DE un-fragmented pkts 162 out DE un-fragmented pkts 0
>> > in timeouts 0
>> > in out-of-sequence fragments 0
>> > in fragments with unexpected B bit set 0
>> > in fragments with skipped sequence number 0
>> > out interleaved packets 0
>> > R5#sh frame-relay fragment
>> > interface dlci frag-type size in-frag out-frag dropped-frag
>> > Se1/0 501 end-to-end 200 4519 86 0
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On 1/12/09, Tyson Scott <tscott@ipexpert.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> Narbik,
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> It is definitely great to know what frame-relay fragmentation does and
>> to
>> >> see how it affects traffic sent thru it. I think that your example is
>> >> great
>> >> for that. But the question is to know when it is necessary. Most
>> tasks
>> >> are
>> >> not specifically going to tell a student to do fragmentation but the
>> >> student
>> >> needs to understand based on the requirements of the question that they
>> >> need
>> >> to do it.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> But really that was a great example of configuring it Narbik.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Regards,
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Tyson Scott - CCIE #13513 R&S and Security
>> >>
>> >> Technical Instructor - IPexpert, Inc.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Telephone: +1.810.326.1444
>> >> Cell: +1.248.504.7309
>> >> Fax: +1.810.454.0130
>> >> Mailto: tscott@ipexpert.com
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Join our free online support and peer group communities:
>> >> http://www.IPexpert.com/communities><
>> http://www.ipexpert.com/communities>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> IPexpert - The Global Leader in Self-Study, Classroom-Based, Video On
>> >> Demand
>> >> and Audio Certification Training Tools for the Cisco CCIE R&S Lab, CCIE
>> >> Security Lab, CCIE Service Provider Lab , CCIE Voice Lab and CCIE
>> Storage
>> >> Lab Certifications.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> From: Narbik Kocharians [mailto:narbikk@gmail.com]
>> >> Sent: Monday, January 12, 2009 3:34 PM
>> >> To: Pavel Bykov
>> >> Cc: Tyson Scott; Hobbs; mike jones; ccielab@groupstudy.com
>> >> Subject: Re: Frame-relay Fragmentation!
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> You should NOT look for words, you should focus on knowing what it does
>> >> and
>> >> where to use it and how and where it helps.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> The topology is as follows:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>>
>> R1---S0/0--10.1.12.1/24-----------------Frame-relay--------------------10.1.
>> >> 12.2/24--S0/0----R2
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> R1's Loopback is 1.1.1.1/8
>> >>
>> >> R2's Loopback is 2.2.2.2/8
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Task 1
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Configure Frame-relay Fragmentation between the two routers such that
>> the
>> >> largest packet size is 80 Bytes.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Both Routers:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Rx(config)#interface S0/0
>> >>
>> >> Rx(config-if)#Frame-relay fragment 80 end-to-end
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> To verify the configuration:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On R1
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> R1#Show frame-relay pvc 102
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> PVC Statistics for interface Serial1/0 (Frame Relay DTE)
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> DLCI = 102, DLCI USAGE = LOCAL, PVC STATUS = ACTIVE, INTERFACE =
>> Serial0/0
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> input pkts 0 output pkts 0 in bytes 0
>> >>
>> >> out bytes 0 dropped pkts 0 in pkts dropped 0
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> out pkts dropped 0 out bytes dropped 0
>> >>
>> >> in FECN pkts 0 in BECN pkts 0 out FECN pkts 0
>> >>
>> >> out BECN pkts 0 in DE pkts 0 out DE pkts 0
>> >>
>> >> out bcast pkts 0 out bcast bytes 0
>> >>
>> >> 5 minute input rate 0 bits/sec, 0 packets/sec
>> >>
>> >> 5 minute output rate 0 bits/sec, 0 packets/sec
>> >>
>> >> pvc create time 00:29:43, last time pvc status changed 00:28:34
>> >>
>> >> fragment type end-to-end fragment size 80
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Note the output of the above show command reveals that Frame-relay
>> >> fragmentation is enabled and the type is set to end-to-end which is
>> FRF.12
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> To test the configuration:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On R1
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> R1#Ping 10.1.12.2 size 80 repeat 1
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Type escape sequence to abort.
>> >>
>> >> Sending 1, 80-byte ICMP Echos to 10.1.12.2, timeout is 2 seconds:
>> >>
>> >> !
>> >>
>> >> Success rate is 100 percent (1/1), round-trip min/avg/max = 64/64/64 ms
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> R1#Show frame-relay fragment 102
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> interface dlci frag-type size in-frag out-frag
>> >> dropped-frag
>> >>
>> >> Se0/0 102 end-to-end 80 2 2
>> >> 0
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Note the fragmentation size is set to 80 Bytes, and the size of the
>> ping
>> >> packet was 80 Bytes as well, but the output of the above show command
>> >> reveals that there were two fragmented packets. This is because the
>> size
>> >> of
>> >> the frame-relay header was NOT considered when the size of the ping
>> packet
>> >> was configured. The actual size of the frame-relay header is 2 Bytes,
>> and
>> >> as
>> >> a result of that, the size of the ping packet was 82 Bytes, therefore,
>> 2
>> >> fragmented packets were generated.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> To test this further:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On R1
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> R1#clear counters
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Clear "show interface" counters on all interfaces [confirm]
>> >>
>> >> R1#
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> R1#Ping 10.1.12.2 size 78 repeat 1
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Type escape sequence to abort.
>> >>
>> >> Sending 1, 78-byte ICMP Echos to 10.1.12.2, timeout is 2 seconds:
>> >>
>> >> !
>> >>
>> >> Success rate is 100 percent (1/1), round-trip min/avg/max = 40/40/40 ms
>> >>
>> >> R1#
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> R1#Show frame-relay fragment 102
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> interface dlci frag-type size in-frag out-frag
>> >> dropped-frag
>> >>
>> >> Se0/0 102 end-to-end 80 0 0
>> >> 0
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Note the above Show command reveals that the ICMP packet was NOT
>> >> fragmented;
>> >> the size of the ICMP packet is 78 Bytes plus the two Bytes of
>> Frame-relay
>> >> header equals to 80 Bytes, therefore, it does not need to get
>> fragmented.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> To test the configuration further:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On R1
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> R1#Ping 10.1.12.2 size 79 repeat 1
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Type escape sequence to abort.
>> >>
>> >> Sending 1, 79-byte ICMP Echos to 10.1.12.2, timeout is 2 seconds:
>> >>
>> >> !
>> >>
>> >> Success rate is 100 percent (1/1), round-trip min/avg/max = 60/60/60 ms
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> R1#Show frame-relay fragment 102
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> interface dlci frag-type size in-frag out-frag
>> >> dropped-frag
>> >>
>> >> Se0/0 102 end-to-end 80 2 2
>> >> 0
>> >>
>> >> R1#
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> i hope this helped.
>> >>
>> >> On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 11:21 AM, Pavel Bykov <slidersv@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Also look for "Large data packets" and "voice packets are prioritized
>> >> although are waiting behind large packets that take long to send out"
>> >>
>> >> Tyson, correction: Reducing delay, since there is no way to prevent it
>> :)
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 7:21 PM, Tyson Scott <tscott@ipexpert.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > Mike,
>> >> >
>> >> > Or if the question talks about preventing serialization delay.
>> >> >
>> >> > Regards,
>> >> >
>> >> > Tyson Scott - CCIE #13513 R&S and Security
>> >> > Technical Instructor - IPexpert, Inc.
>> >> >
>> >> > Telephone: +1.810.326.1444
>> >> > Cell: +1.248.504.7309
>> >> > Fax: +1.810.454.0130
>> >> > Mailto: tscott@ipexpert.com
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > -----Original Message-----
>> >> > From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf
>> Of
>> >> > Hobbs
>> >> > Sent: Monday, January 12, 2009 11:54 AM
>> >> > To: mike jones
>> >> > Cc: ccielab@groupstudy.com
>> >> > Subject: Re: Frame-relay Fragmentation!
>> >> >
>> >> > Off the top of my head, maybe something like "maximum packet size"...
>> >> >
>> >> > On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 9:50 AM, mike jones <ccie1q2008@hotmail.com>
>> >> > wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> > > Group,
>> >> > > What key words in a tasks will lead you to frame-relay
>> >> fragmentation
>> >> > as
>> >> > > the solution?
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> > > Thanks!
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> > > Mike
>> >> > >
>> >> > > _________________________________________________________________
>> >> > > Windows Live : Keep your life in sync.
>> >> > >
>> >>
>> http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_t1_allup_explore_012009
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> > > Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>> <http://www.ccie.net/>
>> >>
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> _______________________________________________________________________
>> >> > > Subscription information may be found at:
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>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net <
>> http://www.ccie.net/>
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> _______________________________________________________________________
>> >> > Subscription information may be found at:
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>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net <
>> http://www.ccie.net/>
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> _______________________________________________________________________
>> >> > Subscription information may be found at:
>> >> > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Pavel Bykov
>> >> ----------------
>> >> Don't forget to help stopping the braindumps, use of which reduces
>> value
>> >> of
>> >> your certifications. Sign the petition at
>> http://www.stopbraindumps.com/
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net <http://www.ccie.net/>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________________________________
>> >> Subscription information may be found at:
>> >> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Narbik Kocharians
>> >> CCSI#30832, CCIE# 12410 (R&S, SP, Security)
>> >> www.MicronicsTraining.com <http://www.micronicstraining.com/> <
>> http://www.micronicstraining.com/>
>> >> www.Net-Workbooks.com <http://www.net-workbooks.com/> <
>> http://www.net-workbooks.com/>
>> >> Sr. Technical Instructor
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________________________________
>> >> Subscription information may be found at:
>> >> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>>
>>
>> --
>> Narbik Kocharians
>> CCSI#30832, CCIE# 12410 (R&S, SP, Security)
>> www.MicronicsTraining.com <http://www.micronicstraining.com/>
>> www.Net-Workbooks.com <http://www.net-workbooks.com/>
>> Sr. Technical Instructor
>>
>>
>> Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net
>>
>> _______________________________________________________________________
>> Subscription information may be found at:
>> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
> 

-- 
Narbik Kocharians
CCSI#30832, CCIE# 12410 (R&S, SP, Security)
www.MicronicsTraining.com
www.Net-Workbooks.com
Sr. Technical Instructor

Blogs and organic groups at http://www.ccie.net

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