From: Dane Newman (dane.newman@gmail.com)
Date: Tue Apr 15 2008 - 17:36:18 ART
Take your golden watch and shove it!
Its not worth 50 years of my life.
1099 > full time slavery
On 4/15/08, Gary Duncanson <gary.duncanson@googlemail.com> wrote:
>
> Joe,
>
> Are you basically saying anyone who is a hardworking loyal company man in
> this day and age is a dork?
>
> I just want to check before I ever consider being a hardworking, loyal
> company man again. Not that it will affect my decision but I will consider
> it!
>
> I agree food is getting more expensive. Cultivate your garden!
>
> Regards
> Gary
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joseph Brunner" <
> joe@affirmedsystems.com>
> To: <rodrigo.gutierrez@nsn.com>; <dane.newman@gmail.com>; <
> gary.duncanson@googlemail.com>
> Cc: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 9:19 PM
> Subject: RE: contract or perm?
>
>
> There is no stability benefit to having a full time j.o.b..
> >
> > You can be let go at any time, for almost any reason, with no severance
> > pay.
> > If broke my leg right now as a contractor, I still have 2 months (at
> > least)
> > of invoices due in that have already been billed for work done.
> >
> > So my severance pay is cushioned in to my billing operations.... (try
> > that
> > on a full time basis).
> >
> > Many friends with children and wives I know left long time full time
> > jobs
> > with 2 WEEKS of severance pay.
> >
> > Also it's about respect. We work in the private sector (most of us). The
> > only way to show an employee respect- is by how much MONEY you pay them.
> > All
> > the parking, training, all that stuff can be offered in the employer's
> > best
> > interest (tax write-offs, product purchase credits for training, etc).
> > It
> > aint getting any cheaper to live, that's for sure. So what good is hope,
> > if
> > my kids want to eat milk and bread today?
> >
> > If you are working weekends and extra hours at night and not being paid
> > cash
> > money every pay day, then you are a sucker. Want to come work for me?
> > I'll give you a Manhattan parking garage, catered lunch, and porno
> > dvd's,
> > and a Mark Hamill autographed Lightsaber from 1983... You just keep
> > working
> > nights and weekends for me for that flat salary.
> >
> > -Joe
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: rodrigo.gutierrez@nsn.com [mailto:rodrigo.gutierrez@nsn.com]
> > Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 4:06 PM
> > To: dane.newman@gmail.com; gary.duncanson@googlemail.com
> > Cc: joe@affirmedsystems.com; ccielab@groupstudy.com
> > Subject: RE: contract or perm?
> >
> > It also depends of the company you want to work for. The company I work
> > right now, contractors make more money daily but they have no benefits,
> > no training and are treated differently company wise(no parking, no
> > insurance, etc). If you want to make more money go contract, if you want
> > to make carrier in a company you want to grow and eventually become
> > manager or so go full time. Also you are suppose to have more stability
> > when u r full time employee(although now days same stuff).
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Rod
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On
> > > Behalf Of ext Dane Newman
> > > Sent: Martes, 15 de Abril de 2008 02:55 p.m.
> > > To: Gary Duncanson
> > > Cc: Joseph Brunner; ccielab@groupstudy.com
> > > Subject: Re: contract or perm?
> > >
> > > There is good and bad to both. I have been contracting free
> > > lance now for about 6 months and would never go back. As a
> > > perm employee I worked every weekend and till midnight more
> > > times then not and hated every unpaid min of it. It seems the
> > > more you know and the better you are at your job the more they
> > > demand of you. I would never ever go back to full time employement.
> > >
> > >
> > > Heres a question for Joseph I know you mentioned cheap way for
> > > health insurance what was that for New Yorkers again?
> > >
> > > Dane
> > >
> > >
> > > On 4/15/08, Gary Duncanson <gary.duncanson@googlemail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > >
> > > > The permy also gets holiday pay, sick pay and the *potential* of
> > > > career progression. Don't forget that. It's important as the
> > > >
> > > metric in
> > >
> > > > terms of earnings between permy and contractor contract.
> > > >
> > > > Personally Im paid by the hour yes, but I do not stop the
> > > >
> > > clock nor do
> > >
> > > > I bill for overruns..unless they are exceptionally long.
> > > >
> > > > Contract or permy..the infrastructure needs defending. Having come
> > > > through support earning stripes through the years before joining the
> > > > designer 'officer ranks' I understand that.
> > > >
> > > > As for police, and fire..well I don't think that's a fair comparison
> > > > at all. Confront the situations those guys have to deal with Joe, I
> > > > think you would shit your pants buddy and forget your hourly rate.
> > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joseph Brunner" <
> > > > joe@affirmedsystems.com>
> > > > To: "'Gary Duncanson'" <gary.duncanson@googlemail.com>; <
> > > > ccielab@groupstudy.com>
> > > > Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 8:14 PM
> > > > Subject: RE: contract or perm?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > All that matters is that you are paid BY THE HOUR...
> > > > >
> > > > > If you work for a full-time job you have to work weekends, nights
> > > > > and other "maintenance periods" for FREE!
> > > > >
> > > > > The hourly employee gets the bets of both worlds... weekdays to
> > > > > attend meetings, do designs, discuss the plan, and
> > > >
> > > weekends to keep
> > >
> > > > > the clock ticking at a nice hourly rate!
> > > > >
> > > > > Do not short your family or yourself! Police, fire, and civil
> > > > > service often are paid by the hour- aren't you worth it?
> > > > >
> > > > > -Joe
> > > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com]
> > > >
> > > On Behalf
> > >
> > > > > Of Gary Duncanson
> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 1:42 PM
> > > > > To: ccielab@groupstudy.com
> > > > > Subject: contract or perm?
> > > > >
> > > > > Group,
> > > > >
> > > > > I realise that this could potentially turn into a difficult thread
> > > > > but I think those with emotional intelligence will prevent that!
> > > > >
> > > > > I wonder if folks could post the benefits of being
> > > >
> > > contract or permy
> > >
> > > > > these days in terms of cisco network/engineer/designer employment.
> > > > >
> > > > > Things have changed..
> > > > >
> > > > > In 1997 companies charged $2000 dollars a day (per technician) for
> > > > > Joe's idiot son to install Windows 95 according to the idiots
> > > > > instructions to move from Novell to NT..*sigh*
> > > > >
> > > > > *caveat* the drive mappings didn't work, nor the printing!
> > > > >
> > > > > *further caveat* Apologies in advance to Joe's mom,
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm sure she's a nice lady who makes great gumbo!
> > > > >
> > > > > It's a different landscape these days but how are you doing?
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Pass the CCIE in six weeks, Guaranteed!
> > > > > http://www.certscience.com/CCIE
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > ____________________________________________________________________
> > >
> > > > > ___ Subscription information may be found at:
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> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Pass the CCIE in six weeks, Guaranteed!
> > > > > http://www.certscience.com/CCIE
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > ____________________________________________________________________
> > >
> > > > > ___ Subscription information may be found at:
> > > > > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Pass the CCIE in six weeks, Guaranteed!
> > > > http://www.certscience.com/CCIE
> > > >
> > > >
> > > ______________________________________________________________________
> > >
> > > > _ Subscription information may be found at:
> > > > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Pass the CCIE in six weeks, Guaranteed!
> > > http://www.certscience.com/CCIE
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________________________________
> > > Subscription information may be found at:
> > > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
> > >
> >
> >
> > Pass the CCIE in six weeks, Guaranteed!
> > http://www.certscience.com/CCIE
> > _______________________________________________________________________
> > Subscription information may be found at:
> > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
> >
>
>
> Pass the CCIE in six weeks, Guaranteed!
> http://www.certscience.com/CCIE
> _______________________________________________________________________
> Subscription information may be found at:
> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/CCIELab.html
Pass the CCIE in six weeks, Guaranteed!
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