From: jslauer@hotmail.com
Date: Thu Mar 22 2007 - 11:23:59 ART
I will heartily agree,
I've used multiple vendors stuff and personally enjoyed my experience at
NMC. I Felt that their classes were sufficient enough to help me
pass...along with a ton of help from other vendors too. Each vendor has a
different approach, I'm not sure I would enjoy the S&M approach that Mr. Ulm
takes to CCIE training. If that's the case, If I ever take his course I want
to bring some brass knuckles to defend myself. Seriously though, I hear his
courses are good...just like all the rest. It's all about the approach.
JL
----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Morris" <swm@emanon.com>
To: "'Darby Weaver'" <darbyweaver@yahoo.com>; "'Danny Cox'"
<dandermanuk@gmail.com>; <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2007 7:53 AM
Subject: RE: Heinz Ulm - Day-2 - 1st Impressions - An impression implies
perception not statistical reality
> While the diatribes are an interesting read (backup career in marketing?),
> I
> do finally have to take issue with something:
>
> "Some CCIE instructors have multiple CCIE's but the very best at RS have
> one
> CCIE RS and Mr. Heinz and Mr. Caslow set the standards for being the very
> best."
>
> While I will be the first to admit that I've never met Mr. Ulm (Heinz is
> first name as I recall), I've known Mr. Caslow for years. Having one or
> multiple CCIE's has nothing to do with making someone the best or better
> than anyone else. It's simply a different set of experiences. I have
> great
> respect for Bruce Caslow (and all the NMC group), but whether they have
> one
> or more CCIEs a piece has nothing to do with the quality or ranking of
> their
> work!
>
> While you appear to have taken the NMC courses and are now in Heinz's
> bootcamp, I certainly appreciate the idea that you can offer personal
> impressions and comparisons between the two illustrating your opinion of
> both of those.
>
> However, until you have honestly met and sat through every vendors course,
> and truly know their styles and/or capabilities, coming up with assertions
> like you do really pushes the novel back to the rank of "marketing fluff"
> rather than a truly valuable piece of information.
>
> So if you are on a mission to make statistical comparisons and a ranking,
> certainly do so. But if not, tone the marketing down a bit. I think we
> get
> the point.
>
> Just my two cents, of course... But I believe that's what makes an
> "impression" anyway, right? ;)
>
>
> Scott Morris, CCIE4 (R&S/ISP-Dial/Security/Service Provider) #4713, JNCIE
> #153, CISSP, et al.
> CCSI/JNCI-M/JNCI-J
> IPexpert VP - Curriculum Development
> IPexpert Sr. Technical Instructor
> smorris@ipexpert.com
> http://www.ipexpert.com
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
> Darby Weaver
> Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2007 4:51 AM
> To: Danny Cox; ccielab@groupstudy.com
> Subject: Re: Heinz Ulm - Day-2 - 1st Impressions - Kinda like the 300, but
> he has 500 CCIE's
>
> Thanks Danny,
>
> Yes - Heinz is unique - he takes situations and turns your weaknesses into
> strengths.
>
> He teaches how to approach a proctor and he teaches his students how to
> MAKE
> an impression.
>
> He hurts uyour feellings and makes you drop your pride at the door.
>
> However, you are thoroughly reminded at how many people looked before who
> walked in your shoes and how many of them got their CCIE's and some within
> days of visiting his bootcamp.
>
> He does not understand how anyone can learn or teach everything for the
> CCIE
> in just 5 or 10 days.
>
> He now offers these in the U.S. but he reminds his students of his 3
> week -
> Get in, Get trained, and Get CCIE philosphy.
>
> He is not nice, his tricks and traps are subtle and if you think you
> spotted
> issue A or even B, you can rest assured you had better find issue C.
>
> His problems are OSI-layered and he expects his students to know the
> difference or if not to learn them - trial by fire.
>
> He and I have talked now at some length and he explained to me about how
> many came unprepared but left enlightened and with solid skills to
> ultimately pass the CCIE Lab - time after time.
>
> One cannot argue his results.
>
> One can only imagine how he keeps his students motivated even when their
> eyes are blood red and their faces are worn out.
>
> Heinz does it time after time - he might as well have a template.
>
> I think you asked about his "Instructors" that he leaves behind. They are
> all former students. The one that is giving a bootcamp in Germany right
> now
> is named "Heiko" and he is a "Dirty Evil Bastard" just like Heinz...
>
> I had the pleasure of experiencing a lab customized by him today... He is
> at least as cunning as Heinz and may even be more...
>
> Heinz is a master. His instructors are chosen and are groomed
> accordingly.
> He watches them just like we watches us.
>
> It is an amazing thing really.
>
> I would say if you can - do whatever you need to do and get 3 weeks to get
> to his classes - even if you had to do them week by week. - Although
> three
> weeks at one time would be best - it seems.
>
> I'm not only preaching this, I'm looking for a way to do it myself.
>
> It is worth it. 3 Weeks in Hell for a career of
> being a more capable CCIE...
>
> Not a bad bargain if I am any judge.
>
> His 3 Week pricing is cheaper that most other vendors
> 2 Week offerings.
>
> His hotel rates are 1/2 to 1/3 the price of places like Herndon - I paid
> over $100.00 and $175.00 for hotels there.
>
> Overall it is not only the most complete training but it also the best
> bargain for the buck.
>
> While I like the InternetworkExpert COD, and I love the reviews. They are
> great but they assume one is going to do labs - Heinz makes no such
> assumptions.
> You simply do labs and more labs and have more problems at each layer of
> the
> OSI-model to contend with.
>
> Totally A-W-E-S-O-M-E!!!
>
> He is professional. He checks his email twice per day while giving
> classes.
>
> He's Germman and is always punctual.
>
> Oh yes - he pays for meals as well - each day - while he continues to
> assail
> your brain with more twisters.
>
> With NMC-1 and NMC-2 -> Probably the closest I have seen to Heinz, their
> is
> no NMC-0 built in... If you are behind and need to catch up, you usually
> have to do it yourself and perhaps take another week or two to repeat the
> class - More $$$ even if only for Travel and Expenses. I've been there
> and
> done that as well.
>
> Heinz covered this gap and covered it quite well. He takes nothing for
> granted. He asks you to come prepared, but if you falter, he is there to
> catch you and berate you a bit and motivate you to move on...
>
>
> His training is simply the B-O-M-B!!!
>
> I'm really wondering why he is not mentioned more here on GS.
>
> He teaches all over the world. Someone in the mideast (Not to mention
> names) used his name to sell their products... Hmmm... Think about this
> one...
>
> He was not happy with it, but imitation is the highest form of flattery.
>
> You won't find his labs on the Internet, on any Newsgroups or any FTP...
> His students appreciate that this is his livelihood and respect that.
>
> You will have to and visit the Master-Jedi Yoda all on your own...
>
> Some CCIE instructors have multiple CCIE's but the very best at RS have
> one
> CCIE RS and Mr. Heinz and Mr.
> Caslow set the standards for being the very best.
>
> In any event it is 3am in Denver and I have to sleep - I'm very dehydrated
> and am still a quite a bit sick.
>
> Later...
>
> Darby
>
>
> --- Danny Cox <dandermanuk@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Useful feedback Derby, thanks - especially as you've spent so much
>> time evaluating so many of the vendors. It's harder in Europe - the
>> best guys are in the US. The only other guy who has a particularly
>> high reputation in Europe that I'm aware of is Martin Shortland of
>> Kinetic Edu but I he's always booked up with company courses
>>
>> Ah well
>>
>> Thanks again and i hope your brain survives
>>
>> Danny
>>
>> On 22/03/07, Darby Weaver <darbyweaver@yahoo.com>
>> wrote:
>> > If I had to explain why his labs are so unique,
>> then
>> > one may never understand...
>> >
>> > Another student wrote me from Germany - Heiko is
>> the
>> > instructor there and apparently he had a play in
>> that
>> > nasty lab I was presented today...
>> >
>> > Someone asked how the quality was of Heinz's instructors were...
>> > Hmmmm... Apparently the
>> apple
>> > did not fall.
>
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