From: Ubaid Iftikhar \(AU\) (Magmax@bigpond.net.au)
Date: Fri Oct 27 2006 - 23:39:46 ART
Guys,
I have tested this in lab
spanning-tree vlan 60 forward-time 7 --------- this command is only require
on root under PVST
-----Original Message-----
From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
Aamir Aziz
Sent: Friday, 1 September 2006 6:53 PM
To: sabrina pittarel
Cc: Sean C.; Victor Cappuccio; GroupStudy
Subject: Re: Forward-delay time
wow thankyou guys that was a great help....
On 9/1/06, sabrina pittarel <sabri_esame@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> Holy cow guys,
> I really cannot stay behind you...you are SO SO active!
> Anyway good thing I have nothing to add when the switches speak!
>
> Well, I cannot refrain myself, there *is* something I should add.
>
> In 802.1d and Cisco PVST you change the timers of the STP on the root
> bridge because the route bridge it is the only swhitch generating the
BPDUs
> (the intermediate switches merely replicate these BPDUs and adjust the
path
> cost).
> But this is not TRUE for RapidSTP. On rapid all switches generates BPDUs
> and I believe (I don't have a switch at end to check) that if you change
the
> hello interval (for example) on an intermediate switch it'll start sending
> its own BPDUs at the configured rate.
>
> Sabrina
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Sean C. <Upp_and_Upp@hotmail.com>
> To: Victor Cappuccio <cvictor@protokolgroup.com>; sabrina pittarel <
> sabri_esame@yahoo.com>
> Cc: GroupStudy <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
> Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2006 11:00:56 PM
> Subject: Re: Forward-delay time
>
> HI Victor,
>
> How are you typing so fast? ;-)
>
> Ok, I think I have it. I think I got mixed up when Scott wrote "... there
> really isn't any magical difference that setting the max-age timer is
> going to
> play!"
>
> I think I misinterpreted what he was confirming.
>
> From what you are showing now (and correlating to what Sabrina wrote
> earlier),
> the root bridge only needs to have the forward-delay settings.
>
> So..., to finish up Aamir's question from the initial post:
> --do we need to issue this command on both the switches or only on where
> the
> Vlan X exists
> The answer is you need to apply the new times to the root switch for that
> respective vlan.
>
> Again, most apprec for the time. I know your date is approaching
> quickly. I
> have confidence if you see anything like this on the lab, you'll blast
> through
> the task quickly and confidently!
> Sean
>
> PS -- I'd like to see the proctor's face when I ask if I can install
> Ethereal/WireShark on my lab PC.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Victor Cappuccio
> To: 'Sean C.' ; 'sabrina pittarel'
> Cc: 'GroupStudy'
> Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2006 7:38 PM
> Subject: RE: Forward-delay time
>
>
> Sorry Sean, I was not following this Thread, to much work this days, So I
> do
> not know what Brian Did, for sure is correct.
>
>
>
> Also Remember that trunk are listed as part of Vlans, so in a well design
> Spanning-tree you would have that vlan also assigned to the trunk port
> (assign
> I
>
> mean Transported)
>
>
>
> Ok lets try it again
>
>
>
> Rack3Sw2(config)#int f0/11
>
> Rack3Sw2(config-if)#sw mo a
>
> Rack3Sw2(config-if)#sw a vlan 143
>
> % Access VLAN does not exist. Creating vlan 143
>
>
>
> At the linux Box
>
>
>
> 22:26:28.981498 802.1d config 808f.00:0e:84:d0:d3:80.800b root
> 808f.00:0e:84:d0:d3:80 pathcost 0 age 0 max 20 hello 2 fdelay 15
>
>
>
> At Sw2
>
> Rack3Sw2(config-if)#do show vlan id 143 | in Stat|Fa
>
> VLAN Name Status Ports
>
> 143 VLAN0143 active Fa0/11
>
>
>
> At Sw1
>
>
>
> Rack3Sw1(config-if)#do show vlan id 143 | in Stat|Fa
>
> VLAN Name Status Ports
>
> 143 VLAN0143 active Fa0/15
>
>
>
> Rack3Sw1(config-if)#do show spanning-tree vlan 143 | in root
>
> This bridge is the root
>
>
>
> Rack3Sw1(config-if)#spanning-tree vlan 143 fo 5
>
>
>
> 22:31:01.852568 802.1d config 808f.00:0e:84:d0:d3:80.800b root
> 808f.00:0b:5f:55:f8:00 pathcost 19 age 1 max 20 hello 2 fdelay 5
>
>
>
> Now if the trunk fails then Sw2 will become the root
>
> 22:30:11.845904 802.1d config TOP_CHANGE 808f.00:0e:84:d0:d3:80.800b root
> 808f.00:0b:5f:55:f8:00 pathcost 19 age 1 max 20 hello 2 fdelay 15
>
> 22:30:13.846076 802.1d config 808f.00:0e:84:d0:d3:80.800b root
> 808f.00:0b:5f:55:f8:00 pathcost 19 age 1 max 20 hello 2 fdelay 15
>
>
>
> Now the question here is to ask the kind proctor,
>
> Dear sir, please could you be so kind in telling me if the trunk is going
> to
> fail near my evaluation ;)
>
>
>
> Victor.-
>
>
>
>
>
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
> -
>
> De: Sean C. [mailto:Upp_and_Upp@hotmail.com]
> Enviado el: Viernes, 01 de Septiembre de 2006 01:21 a.m.
> Para: Victor Cappuccio; 'sabrina pittarel'
> CC: 'GroupStudy'
> Asunto: Re: Forward-delay time
>
>
>
> HI Victor,
>
>
>
> Wow, great post!! But, now I'm more confused then ever! :-)
>
>
>
> Perhaps Brian's Sw2 config also had the forwarding delay altered but it
> just
> wasn't mentioned. So..., somewhere between points 2 and 3 (let's call it
> point 2.5)said:
>
> 2-SW2 is the root.
>
> 2.5-SW2's forwarding delay is configured as 4 seconds for VLAN 100.
>
> 3-SW1's forwarding delay is configured as 4 seconds for VLAN 100.
>
>
>
> This cuts back to the 2nd part of the original email Aamir (remember way
> back when):
>
> --do we need to issue this command on both the switches or only on where
> the
> Vlan X exists
>
>
>
> So..., what happens if, taking your scenario, while SW1 is still the root
> of
> Vlan X, if SW1 doesn't have any physical interfaces assigned to Vlan X,
> can
> the forward-delay just be altered on the SW2?
>
>
>
> Curious for input (and thanks again for the great post),
>
> Sean
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: Victor Cappuccio
>
> To: 'Sean C.' ; 'sabrina pittarel'
>
> Cc: 'GroupStudy'
>
> Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2006 7:02 PM
>
> Subject: RE: Forward-delay time
>
>
>
> Hi Sean
>
>
>
> Sorry, I'm jumping back a thread here.
>
>
>
> But I like more than words, the debugs output
>
>
>
> Using this topology
>
>
>
> Sw1 ---- Trunk ---- Sw2 --- f0/11 --- Linux box
>
>
>
> I have the following
>
>
>
> Rack3Sw1(config)#do show spanning-tree vlan 1
>
>
>
> VLAN0001
>
> Spanning tree enabled protocol ieee
>
> Root ID Priority 8193
>
> Address 000b.5f55.f800
>
> This bridge is the root
>
> Hello Time 2 sec Max Age 20 sec Forward Delay 15 sec
>
>
>
> Bridge ID Priority 8193 (priority 8192 sys-id-ext 1)
>
> Address 000b.5f55.f800
>
> Hello Time 2 sec Max Age 20 sec Forward Delay 15 sec
>
> Aging Time 600
>
>
>
> Interface Role Sts Cost Prio.Nbr Type
>
> ---------------- ---- --- --------- --------
> --------------------------------
>
> Fa0/15 Desg FWD 19 128.15 P2p
>
>
>
>
>
> If I sniff at the Linux Box for packet received
>
> I'm getting this
>
> 21:53:41.585364 802.1d config 2001.00:0e:84:d0:d3:80.800b root
> 2001.00:0b:5f:55:f8:00 pathcost 19 age 1 max 20 hello 2 fdelay 15
>
>
>
> As you can see the FDelay is 15
>
>
>
> If I change the timer at Sw1
>
>
>
> Rack3Sw1(config)#spanning-tree vlan 1 forward-time 4
>
> Rack3Sw1(config)#do show spanning-tree vlan 1 | in Dela
>
> Hello Time 2 sec Max Age 20 sec Forward
> Delay
> 4 sec
>
> Hello Time 2 sec Max Age 20 sec Forward Delay 4 sec
>
>
>
> I'm receiving this at the Linux Box
>
>
>
> 21:54:49.588715 802.1d config 2001.00:0e:84:d0:d3:80.800b root
> 2001.00:0b:5f:55:f8:00 pathcost 19 age 1 max 20 hello 2 fdelay 4
>
>
>
> So as you can see the Root is in charge of sending BPDUs
>
>
>
> If I Change the FDelay at Sw2
>
> Rack3Sw2(config)#spanning-tree vlan 1 forward-time 5
>
> Rack3Sw2(config)#do show spanning-tree vlan 1 | in Dela
>
> Hello Time 2 sec Max Age 20 sec Forward Delay 4 sec
>
> Hello Time 2 sec Max Age 20 sec Forward Delay 5 sec
>
>
>
> The host is still receiving this
>
> 22:00:21.606372 802.1d config 2001.00:0e:84:d0:d3:80.800b root
> 2001.00:0b:5f:55:f8:00 pathcost 19 age 1 max 20 hello 2 fdelay 4
>
>
>
> HTH for something
>
> Victor.-
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Mensaje original-----
> De: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] En nombre de
> Sean
> C.
> Enviado el: Viernes, 01 de Septiembre de 2006 12:31 a.m.
> Para: sabrina pittarel
> CC: GroupStudy
> Asunto: Re: Forward-delay time
>
>
>
> Hi Sabrina,
>
>
>
> Sorry to bring up an email from yesterday, but I'm still trying to wrap
> my
>
> head around a comment of yours: 'THE STP TIMERS MUST BE CHANGED ON THE
> ROOT
>
> BRIDGE FOR THE VLAN AND ONLY THERE!'
>
>
>
> If you still have the email, refer to the excellent email that Brian
> sent.
>
> If I'm understanding Brian's post, while Sw2 is the root bridge, he is
>
> changing the forwarding delay on Switch 1 only:
>
>
>
> Curious for anyone thoughts,
>
> Sean
>
>
>
> 1-In the below example SW1 and SW2 have two trunk links, Fa0/13 (the
> root
>
> port) and Fa0/14.
>
> 2-SW2 is the root.
>
> 3-SW1's forwarding delay is configured as 4 seconds for VLAN 100.
>
> 4-Fa0/13 is shut down on SW2 and Fa0/14 transitions to forwarding on
> SW1
> in
>
> 8 seconds. Note that max-age does not apply:
>
>
>
> SW1#show spanning-tree vlan 100
>
> VLAN0100
>
> Spanning tree enabled protocol ieee
>
> Root ID Priority 32868
>
> Address 000f.8fb2.e800
>
> Cost 19
>
> Port 13 (FastEthernet0/13)
>
> Hello Time 2 sec Max Age 20 sec Forward Delay 4 sec
>
>
>
> Bridge ID Priority 32868 (priority 32768 sys-id-ext 100)
>
> Address 000f.8fe0.3500
>
> Hello Time 2 sec Max Age 20 sec Forward Delay 4 sec
>
> Aging Time 300
>
>
>
> Interface Role Sts Cost Prio.Nbr Type
>
> ---------------- ---- --- --------- --------
> -------------------------------
>
> Fa0/13 Root FWD 19 128.13 P2p
>
> Fa0/14 Altn BLK 19 128.14 P2p
>
>
>
> SW1#
>
> 04:57:14: STP: VLAN0100 new root port Fa0/14, cost 19
>
> 04:57:14: STP: VLAN0100 Fa0/14 -> listening
>
> !
>
> ! AT 14 SECONDS AFTER THE FAILURE IS DETECTED AND FA0/14 GOES INTO
> LISTENING
>
> !
>
> 04:57:15: %LINEPROTO-5-UPDOWN: Line protocol on Interface
> FastEthernet0/13,
>
> changed state to down
>
> 04:57:16: STP: VLAN0100 sent Topology Change Notice on Fa0/14
>
> 04:57:16: %LINK-3-UPDOWN: Interface FastEthernet0/13, changed state to
> down
>
> 04:57:18: STP: VLAN0100 Fa0/14 -> learning
>
> !
>
> ! 4 SECONDS LATER LISTENING EXPIRES AND LEARNING BEGINS
>
> !
>
> 04:57:22: STP: VLAN0100 Fa0/14 -> forwarding
>
> !
>
> ! 4 SECONDS LATER LEARNING EXPIRES AND FORWARDING BEGINS
>
> !
>
>
>
> If max-age were taken into account here the convergence would take 28
>
> seconds (max-age + listening + learning) when in reality is takes just
> 8
>
> seconds (listening + learning)
>
>
>
> SW1#show spanning-tree vlan 100
>
>
>
> VLAN0100
>
> Spanning tree enabled protocol ieee
>
> Root ID Priority 32868
>
> Address 000f.8fb2.e800
>
> Cost 19
>
> Port 14 (FastEthernet0/14)
>
> Hello Time 2 sec Max Age 20 sec Forward Delay 4 sec
>
>
>
> Bridge ID Priority 32868 (priority 32768 sys-id-ext 100)
>
> Address 000f.8fe0.3500
>
> Hello Time 2 sec Max Age 20 sec Forward Delay 4 sec
>
> Aging Time 4
>
>
>
> Interface Role Sts Cost Prio.Nbr Type
>
> ---------------- ---- --- --------- --------
> -------------------------------
>
> Fa0/14 Root FWD 19 128.14 P2p
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: "sabrina pittarel" <sabri_esame@yahoo.com>
>
> To: "Sean C" <tecmochamp@hotmail.com>; <swm@emanon.com>; "ROCHA Leandro
>
> ORANGE-FT" <leandro.rocha@orange-ft.com>; "Aamir Aziz"
> <aamiraz77@gmail.com>
>
> Cc: "GroupStudy" <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2006 9:18 PM
>
> Subject: Re: Forward-delay time
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi,
>
> a word of wisdom the kind proctor shared with me on my failed attempt
> and
>
> that I'm going to share with you now:
>
>
>
> "in the CCIE lab you do what you are asked, not what makes sense".
>
>
>
> About where to change the STP timers.
>
>
>
> THE STP TIMERS MUST BE CHANGED ON THE ROOT BRIDGE FOR THE VLAN AND
> ONLY
>
> THERE!
>
>
>
> Sabrina
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
>
> From: Sean C <tecmochamp@hotmail.com>
>
> To: swm@emanon.com; ROCHA Leandro ORANGE-FT
> <leandro.rocha@orange-ft.com>;
>
> Aamir Aziz <aamiraz77@gmail.com>
>
> Cc: GroupStudy <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2006 12:36:49 PM
>
> Subject: Re: Forward-delay time
>
>
>
> Sorry, I'm jumping back a thread here.
>
>
>
> Scott - concerning your comment "Although the lab scenario may ask you
> to
>
> specifically change one piece, don't automatically assume you have to
>
> recalculate everything else! If you aren't asked to, don't do it."
>
>
>
> Perhaps that is why you have four CCIE's and I'm beyond my fourth
> attempt
> at
>
> my first CCIE. I'd be looking at the scenario in the regards of -
> assuming
>
> that the vlan is on all the switches (possibly via VTP), even if no
> physical
>
> interface is assigned the vlan in question, that the lab would be
> wanting
>
> you to apply the statement to all switches that have that vlan in their
> vlan
>
> database. But, I can certainly understand your reasoning - if only one
> of
>
> the switches has a port applied to that vlan, then only change that
> switch.
>
> Perhaps, the lab would be seeing if you know that you only need to
> apply
> the
>
> command to one switch, it's not something that has to be applied
> everywhere.
>
> Again, thanks for the re-think.
>
>
>
> This is kind-of along the lines of that vaunted question in OSPF where
> the
>
> task is to adjust the auto-cost bandwidth. For the cost to be computed
> the
>
> same on every device, the config would need to be applied to every
> device.
>
> But perhaps the task only is looking to see if you recognize that you
> need
>
> to configure this on one device with that type of interface. <Hope
> that
>
> made sense!>
>
>
>
> Again, thanks,
>
> Sean
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: "Scott Morris" <swm@emanon.com>
>
> To: "'Sean C'" <Upp_and_Upp@hotmail.com>; "'ROCHA Leandro ORANGE-FT'"
>
> <leandro.rocha@orange-ft.com>; "'Aamir Aziz'" <aamiraz77@gmail.com>
>
> Cc: "'GroupStudy'" <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2006 12:33 PM
>
> Subject: RE: Forward-delay time
>
>
>
>
>
> > While technically your thinking is correct and a good idea in REAL
> LIFE
>
> > network design, in the CCIE lab you are often presented with
> scenarios
>
> that
>
> > logically would not play in real life.
>
> >
>
> > Don't over-think things! With a two-switch ethernet network, there
> really
>
> > isn't any magical difference that setting the max-age timer is going
> to
>
> > play! Watch your "show spanning-tree" information to see what the
>
> switches
>
> > do.
>
> >
>
> > Although the lab scenario may ask you to specifically change one
> piece,
>
> > don't automatically assume you have to recalculate everything
> else! If
>
> you
>
> > aren't asked to, don't do it.
>
> >
>
> > If the scenario asked you to keep all of the 802.1D ratios, yet still
> make
>
> > convergence time faster with those specifics, THEN perhaps you'll
> think
>
> down
>
> > this path!
>
> >
>
> > Believe me, this is a path that many people take because of
> real-world
>
> > expectations that we have and knowledge of the actual
>
> > application/implication of changing things like this. But in a lab
>
> > environment, particularly with the limited pieces of equipment that
> we
>
> have,
>
> > you should ask yourself whether it will make a difference, or not
> work
>
> > properly otherwise.
>
> >
>
> > HTH,
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > Scott Morris, CCIE4 (R&S/ISP-Dial/Security/Service Provider) #4713,
> JNCIE
>
> > #153, CISSP, et al.
>
> > CCSI/JNCI-M/JNCI-J
>
> > IPExpert VP - Curriculum Development
>
> > IPExpert Sr. Technical Instructor
>
> > smorris@ipexpert.com
>
> > http://www.ipexpert.com
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > -----Original Message-----
>
> > From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf
> Of
>
> Sean
>
> > C
>
> > Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2006 11:49 AM
>
> > To: ROCHA Leandro ORANGE-FT; Aamir Aziz
>
> > Cc: GroupStudy
>
> > Subject: Re: Forward-delay time
>
> >
>
> > Hi Leandro,
>
> >
>
> > If the task was asking to go from blocking to forwarding state in
> under
> 16
>
> > secs, wouldn't that be when you would take into consideration the
> max-age
>
> > timer?
>
> >
>
> > This task specifically states to alter the forward-delay time only,
>
> nothing
>
> > about altering the entire STP equation - "Configure the forward-delay
> time
>
> > of a Vlan X under 16 seconds." Taking the task into consideration, I
>
> would
>
> > just alter the forward-time to a value of 7.
>
> >
>
> > I understand what you're trying to do, I'm just not sure that your
> answer
>
> > would meet the requirements of this task.
>
> >
>
> > Also, Aamir - to answer the 2nd part of your original post - "do we
> need
>
> to
>
> > issue this command on both the switches or only on where the Vlan X
>
> exists."
>
> > - while, technically, you would only need to apply it to a switch
> where
>
> the
>
> > vlan exists - personally - as long as the vlan in question is able to
> be
>
> on
>
> > the 2nd switch (no vlan pruning, or the switch w/out the vlan is a
> VTP
>
> > transparent switch, etc...), I would apply the timer to both
> switches.
>
> > Or, if I was really questioning it, I would ask the proctor something
>
> along
>
> > the lines of "Should I take into consideration the chances of that
> vlan
>
> > being used on the 2nd switch in the future?...."
>
> >
>
> > HTH,
>
> > Sean
>
> >
>
> > ----- Original Message -----
>
> > From: "ROCHA Leandro ORANGE-FT" <leandro.rocha@orange-ft.com>
>
> > To: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
>
> > Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2006 10:05 AM
>
> > Subject: RE: Forward-delay time
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > > I think we have to take in account the max-age timer too.
>
> > >
>
> > > To have less than 16 seconds in any case, we should put max-age to
> 6
> and
>
> > > fwd-delay to 4 (the minimum values).
>
> > >
>
> > > Then we have a total of 6+4+4=14.
>
> > >
>
> > > Leandro
>
> > >
>
> > >
>
> > >
>
> > >
>
> > >
>
> > > "Brian McGahan" <bmcgahan@internetworkexpert.com>
>
> > > Sent by: nobody@groupstudy.com
>
> > > 08/30/06 10:39 AM
>
> > > Please respond to "Brian McGahan"
>
> > >
>
> > >
>
> > > To: "Aamir Aziz" <aamiraz77@gmail.com>,
>
> > <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
>
> > > cc:
>
> > > bcc:
>
> > > Subject: RE: Forward-delay time
>
> > >
>
> > >
>
> > >
>
> > > The forward-delay command configures each of the listening and
>
> > > learning phase timers. This means that if you have it configured
> as
> 15
>
> > > that it will take 30 seconds to go through both phases. If you
> want
> to
>
> > > move from blocking to forwarding in less than 16 seconds your
> forward
>
> > > delay would have to be 8 or lower.
>
> > >
>
> > > Brian McGahan, CCIE #8593
>
> > > bmcgahan@internetworkexpert.com
>
> > >
>
> > > Internetwork Expert, Inc.
>
> > > http://www.InternetworkExpert.com
>
> > > Toll Free: 877-224-8987 x 705
>
> > > Outside US: 775-826-4344 x 705
>
> > > 24/7 Support: http://forum.internetworkexpert.com
>
> > > Live Chat: http://www.internetworkexpert.com/chat/
>
> > >
>
> > >
>
> > > > -----Original Message-----
>
> > > > From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On
> Behalf
>
> > > Of
>
> > > > Aamir Aziz
>
> > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2006 6:48 AM
>
> > > > To: ccielab@groupstudy.com
>
> > > > Subject: Forward-delay time
>
> > > >
>
> > > > Hi there,
>
> > > >
>
> > > > If the task says Configure the forward-delay time of a Vlan X
> under
> 16
>
> > > > second then what value do we use 15 or 16?
>
> > > >
>
> > > > #spanning-tree VLAN X forward-time 15 or 16
>
> > > >
>
> > > > since by default it is 15, and do we need to issue this command
> on
>
> > > both
>
> > > > the
>
> > > > switches or only on where the Vlan X exists.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > Thanks
>
> > > > Aamir
>
> > > >
>
> > > >
>
> > >
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