From: Chuck Church (ccie8776@rochester.rr.com)
Date: Thu Jan 16 2003 - 22:50:42 GMT-3
I've never really liked the term bootcamp for these preparation classes.
'Bootcamp' implies taking totally untrained people and giving them 'basic'
training. The NMC class and others like it are not geared for people with
'basic' (CCNP-level) training. You definitely want to have a thorough
understanding of at least the two Doyle books, and the Halabi book before
taking one of these classes. We really need a better term for these
classes.
Chuck Church
CCIE #8776, MCNE, MCSE
----- Original Message -----
From: "Joseph Rinehart" <jjrinehart@hotmail.com>
To: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 6:46 PM
Subject: Re: OT:Cyscoexpert and NLI Experiences
> Always a good question, I was curious as to what the opinion was (from
those
> who took a bootcamp there) as to whether the 40 hour bootcamp was
sufficient
> in preparation. I have checked around a lot for a decent but affordable
> bootcamp and got severe sticker shock (starting at 3000 and up to 10,000).
> The value prop for me is by taking a bootcamp avoids a large number of lab
> attempts (at 1250 per exam its pricey to take many times).
>
> Any input?
>
> Joe
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jason Sinclair" <sinclairj@powertel.com.au>
> To: "'Chris Home'" <clarson52@comcast.net>; "Todd Veillette"
> <tveillette@myeastern.com>; "cebuano" <cebu2ccie@cox.net>
> Cc: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
> Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 2:35 PM
> Subject: RE: OT:Cyscoexpert and NLI Experiences
>
>
> > This raises an interesting issue of value of the lab? I know Peter Van
> Oene
> > often brings up this as an issue.
> >
> >
> >
> > Jason Sinclair CCIE #9100
> > Manager, Network Control Centre
> > POWERTEL
> > 55 Clarence Street,
> > SYDNEY NSW 2000
> > AUSTRALIA
> > office: + 61 2 8264 3820
> > mobile: + 61 416 105 858
> > email: sinclairj@powertel.com.au
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Chris Home [mailto:clarson52@comcast.net]
> > Sent: Friday, 17 January 2003 00:18
> > To: Todd Veillette; cebuano
> > Cc: ccielab@groupstudy.com
> > Subject: Re: OT:Cyscoexpert and NLI Experiences
> >
> > Good point. I have often thought that real world experience has led to
> > confusion and detraction from lab study.
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Todd Veillette" <tveillette@myeastern.com>
> > To: "cebuano" <cebu2ccie@cox.net>
> > Cc: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
> > Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 7:55 AM
> > Subject: Re: OT:Cyscoexpert and NLI Experiences
> >
> >
> > > Well I am one. I have taken the lab twice,
> > > both unsucessful. I have literally thousands
> > > of hours on Routers, Switches, etc. over the last
> > > 10 years or so. Unfortunately, 95% of all my
> > > configuration time is real world. Minimum
> > > 10 hours a day every day last 3 years especially.
> > >
> > > I would attribute my not passing to two factors.
> > > Lots of real world experience, definately detracts from
> > > the "off the wall things you must accomplish in the lab".
> > > The 2 methodologies detract from each other. Real world
> > > you have to make it work, with a specific goal of keeping
> > > everything stable, so correct design and optimumization are
> > > of utmost importantance. The lab - speed at which you can mesh
> > > all kinds of off the walls scenarios together, in a fashion that as
long
> > > as it limps its good to go.
> > > Second, a human charasteristic, I was dealt more than my fair share
> > > of brain "RAM", it just happens to be the 60mSec access type vs,
> > > the 10uSec access type :-).
> > >
> > > -TV
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "cebuano" <cebu2ccie@cox.net>
> > > To: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
> > > Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 1:30 AM
> > > Subject: RE: OT:Cyscoexpert and NLI Experiences
> > >
> > >
> > > > Okay,
> > > > How come we NEVER hear from people who attend bootcamps and up to
this
> > > > day still can't pass the lab?
> > > > What I'm saying is that there has to be some kind of
"Pre-assessment"
> > > > test/lab for potential customers so they know whether they're going
to
> > > > really benefit from these bootcamps or just waste their precious
> > > > dollars.
> > > >
> > > > Personally, if I was running a bootcamp, I'd SCREEN my "students" so
> > > > they don't go out to the public criticizing my training program for
> not
> > > > getting what it's designed to accomplish. I know there is NO
guarantee
> > > > in these bootcamps.
> > > >
> > > > I'm sure there are a lot of potential customers on this list who
have
> > > > the same reservations on spending a couple thousand dollars.
> > > >
> > > > My 2 cents.
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf
> Of
> > > > Chris Home
> > > > Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 11:35 PM
> > > > To: jim.phillipo@guardent.com; ccielab@groupstudy.com
> > > > Subject: Re: OT:Cyscoexpert and NLI Experiences
> > > >
> > > > I have heard excellent things about CyscoExpert and know a lot of
> > > > people
> > > > who passed first time who give them lot's of credit!!
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: <jim.phillipo@guardent.com>
> > > > To: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
> > > > Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 6:59 PM
> > > > Subject: OT:Cyscoexpert and NLI Experiences
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > I am looking into a bootcamp and these two seem to both be very
> good.
> > > > >
> > > > > Any input ?
> > > > >
> > > > > TIA
> > > > >
> > > > > Jim
> > > > >
> > > > > Jim Phillipo, CCNP, CCDP
> > > > > Sr. Internetworking Engineer
> > > > > W: 401.456.1821 F: 401.456.0599 M: 508.982.8923
> > > > > 90 Royal Little Drive, Providence, RI 02904
> > > > > www.guardent.com
> > > > > _____________________________________________________
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